Can someone explain what "1st ed feel" is?

[mark_j]

1st Edition feel is playing for 14 hours straight fueled by Mountain Dew and only stopping because you were about to fall unconsious, 3rd Edition feel is playing for 4 hours and realizing that it wasn't fun and if one more player told you that they were going to "take a 5 foot step" you were going to punch them in the face.

J/K (sort of), 1st Edition feel is about "save or die" and "save vs. wands" and Huge Ancient Red Dragons with 88 hit points. Those that love 1st Edition know what I'm talking about. Those that don't, don't.

 

[Henry]

Reading Mark J's post just sent a memory-chill up my spine.

 

[mark_j]

Reading Mark J's post just sent a memory-chill up my spine.

On a side note....I just converted a 3E campaign that I have been running for 2+ years into 1E. The players were willing because I told them that I wasn't willing to write any new material for 3E > Our normal 3E session was 3-5 hours long and it left me fatigued. Our first 1E session was 7 hours long and we had to quit at midnight because we had to get up for work early the next morning. Nobody wanted to stop!

Of course, it could be that my DMing was better than usual because I actually had some passion to DM again (instead of running 3E, which feels more like being a referee), but my players raved about the old system (having never played 1E before).

 

[Doug McCrae]

1st Edition feel is playing for 14 hours straight fueled by Mountain Dew and only stopping because you were about to fall unconsious, 3rd Edition feel is playing for 4 hours and realizing that it wasn't fun and if one more player told you that they were going to "take a 5 foot step" you were going to punch them in the face.

We were playing 10-11 hour sessions of our 3.5 campaign just recently concluded. Start at 6pm, finish 4-5am. My longest 1st ed sessions were 4 hours, coincidentally. I used to play on Saturday afternoons round at friend's houses from 2-6pm.

 

[mark_j]

We were playing 10-11 hour sessions of our 3.5 campaign just recently concluded. Start at 6pm, finish 4-5am. My longest 1st ed sessions were 4 hours, coincidentally. I used to play on Saturday afternoons round at friend's houses from 2-6pm.

Just the type of response I expected! I'm glad you have fun playing 3.5, I support D&D in all its forms. I just can't stand to "referee" another 3.5 session of "combat chess." I'm quite willing to play any edition though. I just only enjoy writing material for 1E and running 1E games.

One of my players just referred to 3/3.5 as the "Monopoly" version of D&D because of the rules structure, etc. I coudn't agree more. It does feel more controlled and sterile than 1E. Some people like their fantasy rpgs to be realistic and streamlined, I prefer mine with more fantasy and less tactics.

But, only my opinion.

 

[der_kluge]

Hey, wait a minute, people are dissing 2e and 3e in here. Shouldn't we close the thread now?

 

[mark_j]

Hey, wait a minute, people are dissing 2e and 3e in here. Shouldn't we close the thread now?

I am sorry, I know edition wars are a big no-no. I don't want to cause a thread to be locked because of my big mouth.

D&D is a wonderful thing, no matter what edition you prefer. I'll shutup now

 

[Virel]

mark_j

Welcome to Enworld. Please stop by Dragonsfoot if you like 1st ed AD&D as it is an excellent site dedicated to out of print D&D. It's one of my favorite sites for older edition games as I still play & DM OAD&D

Check out www.dragonsfoot.org

 

[mark_j]

mark_j

Welcome to Enworld. Please stop by Dragonsfoot if you like 1st ed AD&D as it is an excellent site dedicated to out of print D&D. It's one of my favorite sites for older edition games as I still play & DM OAD&D

Check out www.dragonsfoot.org

Thank you for the invitation! I am also a member of Dragonsfoot. However, "mark_j" was not available there, so my handle at Dragonsfoot is "saveordie"

I've seen your posts there as well.

 

[maddman75]

I don't agree that the "Cinematic" style is about mechanics like plot points or drama points.

As I see it, the essence of these "styles" is that they aren't rules-dependent. You can write a scripted "storytelling" adventure for 1e AD&D (and Tracy Hickman frequently did); it's also probably possible to write a decent wargame-style adventure for 3.5e D&D (although I've never seen anyone actually do this.)

Yes, of course. You can run any style with any game system. You can also put screws into wood with a hammer. Doesn't mean its a good idea. Mechanics don't restrict the GM - he's going to do what he wants. They *do* restrict the players, and most players will do whatever the system rewards them for. So, to get the feel you want just reward whatever you want the players to do.

The "cinematic" style is a more free-form adventure where the players can influence the outcome at critical points. The key here is that the DM is prepared to sublimate the dramatic "needs" of the story to the player's desire to have their character in control of events.

It's a positive step, but I do not personally believe that any of the attempts I have seen have made a real success out of "cinematic" adventuring precisely because they have depended too much on the expenditure of what one of my players calls "posing points." In other words, in the attempts I have seen, the player has more success in influencing events by flamboyant and dramatic actions than by subtle and intelligent ones.

This is a feature, not a bug. I for one am bored to tears of everyone trying to do the smart thing, or the clever thing, because if they don't the GM will mash their character into putty. I want a character to go after the Big Bad when he really shouldn't, and get beat up but survive. I want them to charge in when they should flee. I want them to be able to play the Stupid Card if that's what makes things more fun and not reward them with character death.

I think the "cinematic" style is one to watch, though, because it is presently the best hope for the game. It is starting to give a bit of control over events back to the players, and a consequence of this is that player skill is once more starting to result in character success.

I think what's needed is for the "cinematic" style to copy the more intelligent films as well as the action ones...

What do you mean by Player Skill?