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Can we please stop calling D&D Insider an MMORPG

Wai- what?!?

cperkins said:
As a guy who has never and will never play a MMORPG, the new version of D&D looks to be heavily influenced by World of Warcraft and other MMORPGs

So in other words, you're passing judgment on something you haven't experienced and have little knowledge of by comparing it to something else you haven't experienced and (based on your comments below) have little knowledge of? The next president of the US is going to suck because he or she's exactly like Napoleon!

(30-level progression

Ignoring the fact that I don't know of any MMOs which go to level 30 (50 and 60 are typical, with the cap being raised by 5 or 10 for each expansion), what the hell does this have to do with anything? What would it matter if it were 5 levels or 500?

On top of that, it's really not any different from D&D as it stands today. They've said that level 21-30 is epic, and all they've done is integrated epic rules into the core rules.

, character "power-ups" that sound more akin to Mortal Combat than D&D

Once more, I really need to restrain myself from making any ad hominem attacks... Mortal Kombat (with a K) is a fighting game, about as far as you could possibly get from an MMO. On top of that, there are no power ups in MK. Compare that to D&D, where before every fight characters need to wait five minutes for their clerics to bless them and check to make sure that they remember the activation words for all their nifty magic items.

moving away from Greyhawk and other D&D sacred cows)

The first setting they're publishing, much to my consternation, is Forgotten Realms, which is arguably more popular to the older crowd than Greyhawk. Certainly, I'd expect a much larger outcry if they nixed FR and continued Greyhawk in its stead. On top of that, they're keeping the proper names from Greyhawk, whatever that means (I guess that means with spells).

Incidentally, you do realize that "sacred cow" is a loaded term, which bears with it the connotation that something which is a "sacred cow" is bad and is only around because it's always been around... right? So basically, you just complained that 4e is getting rid of bad stuff.
 

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smootrk said:
If it looks like a duck, and sounds like a duck, then it is likely a duck!

Pay for online access to games (and other content), play games online, gotta pay subscription rates to play... sounds a lot like the model for MMORG to me.

You can play MMORPG games offline and then get bonus content and additional gaming opportunities by paying an extra fee? Wow, I missed that when I played World or Warcraft.
 

RigaMortus2 said:
Pay more? Actually, it is less. Going with your estiamte, Dragon was $120 a year. Now throw in Dungeon mag as well (since that content is also part of DI) and that is another what, another $120? So that's $240 a year if you subscribed to both mags. D&DI is reported to cost $9.95 a month (or, $120 a year). So not only are you getting the content of BOTH Dragon and Dungeon mag at a smaller price than you would be paying for them, you also get all the other content (character creator, the online map/grid, etc.).

Not only are you NOT paying more fpr D&DI vs. the mags, you're actually paying less.

Actually, he very specifically said Dragon wasn't $120 a year. Actually, if you subscribed, you got a heavy discount. Don't remember how much exactly, but I recall it saying that it either cost you $45 or saved you $45, so let's say it was somewhere in the $40-$60 range for one magazine. Thus, less than $120 a year for both.

That said, all indications are that the Dungeon and Dragon equivalents are going to be web-based, so it's simple enough to click File -> Save and have the contents of any article you like forever on your hard disk, with all the images and everything. Heck, it beats the crap out of having to sort through a poorly-organized library of dragon articles... Instead of pulling every single one out just to look at the Class Acts while you're making your new wizard, you just browse to your Class Acts folder, and then the Wizards subfolder of that, press control+a and then enter and you've got them all open.
 

Whizbang Dustyboots said:
Sacred cow is value neutral. Cows are, in fact, actually sacred in India, after all.

Going to have to respectfully disagree with you... Cows may well be sacred to certain religions, but doesn't change the fact that the term sacred cow, outside of that context, has negative connotations.

See definitions at dictionary.com and google

A sacred cow is a person, institution, idea (often a theory - then: "pet theory") or ideology that is immune (usually unreasonably so) from criticism or opposition.
 

king_ghidorah said:
You can play MMORPG games offline and then get bonus content and additional gaming opportunities by paying an extra fee? Wow, I missed that when I played World or Warcraft.
There is plenty of offline (at least out of game) WoW stuff to browse through. There are areas/information that only subscribers get access to. But you are right, you cant play offline, but somehow I doubt you can play these online d&d games offline either. That is the nature of online games. duh
 

smootrk said:
There is plenty of offline (at least out of game) WoW stuff to browse through. There are areas/information that only subscribers get access to. But you are right, you cant play offline, but somehow I doubt you can play these online d&d games offline either. That is the nature of online games. duh

That's the rub, though. They're not online D&D games, they're D&D games which are online.

Incidentally, one thing that hasn't been brought up yet is that you don't need to pay Wizards to play D&D 4th edition online.

I'm sure that OpenRPG and all the other myriad tools out there will have support for 4th edition. Heck, IIRC (it's been a long time), OpenRPG is a completely modular and user-editable system, meaning that it will support 4th edition the moment the book's released.
 



smootrk said:
If it looks like a duck, and sounds like a duck, then it is likely a duck!

Pay for online access to games (and other content), play games online, gotta pay subscription rates to play... sounds a lot like the model for MMORG to me.

Obviously you have no clue what an MMORPG is.
 

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