D&D 5E Can you cast flame blade and then make an improvised weapon attack with the flame blade?

[Maxperson]

The blade is a fiery blade, it doesn't say it's literally only made of fire. But we know SOMETHING is in your hand. It's not VFX - you hold the blade, and if you open your hand the blade goes away. Something is physically there to hold. For my game, that's an object.

If it were not made only of fire, it would do damage other than fire. A Flame Tongue doesn't just do 2d6 fire damage. At best only the hilt is solid.

Edit: Ice Storm does physical and cold damage. Meteor Swarm does physical and fire damage. If a damage dealing spell is both physical and energy, both deal damage.

 

[Maxperson]

I saw this in the new UA and thought it might be applicable to this discussion.

"When you take the Magic action, you magic something by casting a spell that has a casting time of an action or by using a feature or Magic Item that requires a Magic action to be activated."

The attack of flame blade might use the magic action in 2024 as the spell attack each round could be considered to be a feature of the spell.

 

[Mistwell]

It's very clearly a sword, which is not an improvised weapon. If the wording was vague and it made just a fire in your hand that did damage, then I could see what you're saying. Nothing is vague, though. It's a sword.

It's not "very clearly" anything if multiple people view it differently. That's the test of whether something is vague or not - how do multiple people view it. If they all seem to view it differently (and in this thread they do) it's probably vague no matter how confident you personally view it in a particular way. I am glad it's very clear for your game though?

 

[Maxperson]

It's not "very clearly" anything if multiple people view it differently. That's the test of whether something is vague or not - how do multiple people view it. If they all seem to view it differently (and in this thread they do) it's probably vague no matter how confident you personally view it in a particular way. I am glad it's very clear for your game though?

Then whether the Earth is round is also vague. Everything is contested by people who view it differently.

If it's a blade shaped like a sword, it's a sword. That's what swords are. That's what the spell is.

 

[James Gasik]

This reminds me of a video I just watched asking how many corners does a semicircle have. 0, 2, 3, or infinite are all valid answers.

 

[Mistwell]

Then whether the Earth is round is also vague. Everything is contested by people who view it differently.

If it's a blade shaped like a sword, it's a sword. That's what swords are. That's what the spell is.

This isn't like a scientific question you can prove. It's a subjective question.

The shape isn't the only determination if something is "like" another weapon. Is the weight the same? Does it have the same amount of friction when swung through the air? We don't know. So to me, it's an object because you're holding it, and it does a fixed amount of damage when it hits something, but I don't think it's the equivalent-enough of a scimitar to call it that because we lack information on other aspects besides shape. You do think you have enough from the "shape" data. Cool. That's not enough for me and it is for you.

There is no "I'm right" button for you to push on this. The OP asked for an interpretation, I gave mine, others gave theirs, so far nobody has seen it exactly like yours or mine, so what's with the "I insist my interpretation is the on true answer" stuff? Let it go man, we can agree to disagree about what a rule means.

 

[Maxperson]

This isn't like a scientific question you can prove. It's a subjective question.

The shape isn't the only determination if something is "like" another weapon. Is the weight the same? Does it have the same amount of friction when swung through the air? We don't know. So to me, it's an object because you're holding it, and it does a fixed amount of damage when it hits something, but I don't think it's the equivalent-enough of a scimitar to call it that because we lack information on other aspects besides shape. You do think you have enough from the "shape" data. Cool. That's not enough for me and it is for you.

There is no "I'm right" button for you to push on this. The OP asked for an interpretation, I gave mine, others gave theirs, so far nobody has seen it exactly like yours or mine, so what's with the "I insist my interpretation is the on true answer" stuff? Let it go man, we can agree to disagree about what a rule means.

So according to you having the same shape as a weapon(a sword) doesn't make it a weapon. Weight doesn't make it a weapon, because weapons weigh anywhere from 1/4 to 18 pounds, and that's before we get into giant weapons. Weapons also have several different amounts of air friction, so that can't be it.

So if appearance, weight and air friction don't make something a weapon, what does? It seems like only intent is left. Flame blade is intended to be used to hurt other people, unlike say a table leg or tree limb. Going by intent flame blade is a weapon.

Of course the blade itself still doesn't have any physicality, because they didn't give the spell any kind of physical damage component like they do with spells that are both physical and energy. Objects deal physical damage when used as a weapon or improvised weapon.

 

[Incenjucar]

If you treat the flame blade as having a solid component:
"I use the flame blade as a crowbar"
"I jam the flame blade into the trap door to keep it from closing"
"I use the flame blade as shovel"

 

[James Gasik]

Since the Flame Blade has the shape of a scimitar, is it a finesse weapon? Can it be used with Defensive Duelist? Sneak Attack?

I'm pretty sure that's a "no" to all three questions, lol.

 

[Baron Opal II]

Since the Flame Blade has the shape of a scimitar, is it a finesse weapon? Can it be used with Defensive Duelist? Sneak Attack?

I'm pretty sure that's a "no" to all three questions, lol.

Well, an arcane trickster could use a damaging single target spell with sneak attack, right?