Can you use skill focus to achieve other feats?

[Jack Simth]

Martial Study (Tome of Battle: Book of Nine Swords) will let you pick a martial maneuver; there's a Diamond Mind maneuver that lets you replace a Fort save with a Concentration check as an immediate action once per encounter.

 

[Persiflage]

Many thanks. One more question. Is there a feat that allows a player to use their reflex save instead of their fortitude save. Trying to make a decent rogue.

There's an Epic feat called Dexterous Fortitude that does exactly what you describe. But of course you need to be 21st level+ to get Epic feats, which I suspect means that this won't be of a lot of use.

Otherwise, your best bet is to dip to Swordsage at 5th level (no bad thing anyway) to grab the Diamond Mind maneuver Mind Over Body, which will allow you to make the Concentration check that Jack refers to in place of your Fortitude save.

Of course, the real reason for dipping Swordsage at 5th is to pick up Assassin's Stance for a permanent extra 2d6 sneak attack damage and to qualify for the Shadow Blade feat, which lets you get your Dex modifier as a bonus to melee damage when using Shadow Hand weapons.

Shadow Blade is assuming you're a melee rogue of course, but there's an awful lot of goodness to be gained from a 1-level Swordsage dip no matter what flavour of sneaky you prefer.

Alright. Lastly, is there an item of feat that grants immunity to transformation? If not what would you price an item with these specs at?

There's a feat, but only if you're a Druid so that one's out. Your best bet, if the race is open to you, is to be a Changeling (Eberron Campaign Setting, but could readily fit any world). That gives you the Shapechanger subtype: you won't be immune to being polymorphed or whatnot, but you can return to your original form as a standard action.

Again, relevant if you're a melee rogue, it also lets you qualify for Warshaper. Dipping a couple of levels there gives you immunity to stunning and critical hits, a boost to your Fortitude save (which nicely complements the Reflex and Will boosts you get from dipping Swordsage), a further boost to your Fortitude save from the +4 to Con...

The downside to the dips is the hit you'll take to your base attack bonus: ask your kindly DM if they'll use the partial BAB calculation rules.

The only PrC's I know of that actually grant you the Shapechanger subtype if you don't already have it require you to be a spellcaster to start with (Druid for Master of Many Forms or arcane caster with polymorph for Master Transmogrifist) so there's probably not much help for you there.

 

[Jinete]

Of course, the real reason for dipping Swordsage at 5th is to pick up Assassin's Stance for a permanent extra 2d6 sneak attack damage and to qualify for the Shadow Blade feat, which lets you get your Dex modifier as a bonus to melee damage when using Shadow Hand weapons.

Shadow Blade is assuming you're a melee rogue of course, but there's an awful lot of goodness to be gained from a 1-level Swordsage dip no matter what flavour of sneaky you prefer.

IIRC the first stance you get must always be a first level stance. So you'd need a 2 level dip to get Assassin's Stance.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

There's an Epic feat called Dexterous Fortitude that does exactly what you describe. But of course you need to be 21st level+ to get Epic feats, which I suspect means that this won't be of a lot of use.

Aside from being an epic feat, all it requires is Dex 25 and Slippery Mind class feature. Thus, it's an option for Dragonwrought Kobolds long before epic.

Otherwise, your best bet is to dip to Swordsage at 5th level (no bad thing anyway) to grab the Diamond Mind maneuver Mind Over Body, which will allow you to make the Concentration check that Jack refers to in place of your Fortitude save.

Of course, the real reason for dipping Swordsage at 5th is to pick up Assassin's Stance for a permanent extra 2d6 sneak attack damage and to qualify for the Shadow Blade feat, which lets you get your Dex modifier as a bonus to melee damage when using Shadow Hand weapons.

9th level. 8 levels in "not swordsage" count for half, so 4 +1 = 5. You need Initiator level 5 to use 3rd level maneuvers and stances. Also, your first stance in any adept class is required (check each of their descriptions) to be a 1st level stance. You would need a second Swordsage level or the Martial Stance feat to get Assassin's Stance. Still totally worth it, and in the meantime, if you do enter at 9 (a level you get a feat at), the Child of Shadow and Island of Blades Shadow Hand 1st level stances are also nice pick ups, so you can still get Shadow Blade at level 9 even though you don't have Assassin's Stance yet.

I like to also try and fit in Adaptive Style feat at some point to recover/rearrange all readied maneuvers with a single turn, rather than the Swordsage's godawful maneuver recovery mechanic. Chances are in many combats you'll want/need Distracting Ember and Cloak of Deception (ALWAYS get these, as a Rogue) more than once, and possibly Shadow Garrote, too.

There's a feat, but only if you're a Druid so that one's out. Your best bet, if the race is open to you, is to be a Changeling (Eberron Campaign Setting, but could readily fit any world). That gives you the Shapechanger subtype: you won't be immune to being polymorphed or whatnot, but you can return to your original form as a standard action.

Full round action. Otherwise, I agree completely. Changeling's a great social rogue with an awesome racial substitution level at 1 (10 + Int skill points, and it gets the x4 multiplier!), and as you note, allows entry into Warshaper.

The downside to the dips is the hit you'll take to your base attack bonus: ask your kindly DM if they'll use the partial BAB calculation rules.

If you do this, it's also only fair that you accept the partial base save rules, too. That was you can't get a +2 from a good save class more than once (good saves give you +2 +1/2 class level normally). The BAB one always helps or at least doesn't hurt you, the partial saves rule at best doesn't affect you, at worst nerfs your saves a bit. So IMHO they should come as a package deal.

 

[Persiflage]

Hang on, start again, I'm posting all out of sequence now! Back in a minute

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

[MENTION=55689]Jinete[/MENTION]: I don't believe that you recall correctly: where does it say that you have to learn a 1st-level stance before you can learn one of a higher level?

Page 16, first line of the "Stances Known" class feature.
"You begin play with knowledge of one 1st level stance from any discipline open to you."

Now, is this the intent, that even multiclassing in at higher levels restricts your first stance so? I wouln't think so, but ALL of the 3 classes have similar text in their descriptions (Crusader page 10; Warblade page 22), which can't help but lead me to think it was completely intentional. If nothing else, it's undeniably RAW.

EDIT: ...if you were trying to mention/tag me, please don't I find the notices annoying as hell, and I can check threads I've posted in regularly without a reminder.

 

[Persiflage]

Aside from being an epic feat, all it requires is Dex 25 and Slippery Mind class feature. Thus, it's an option for Dragonwrought Kobolds long before epic.

Characters gain epic feats in the following ways:
At 21st level, and every three levels thereafter, the character may select an epic feat in place of a nonepic feat.
Each character class gains bonus epic feats according to the class description. These feats must be selected from the list of bonus epic feats for that class.

So, no Dragonwrought Kobold shenanigans; you've got to be 21st level for an Epic feat.

9th level. 8 levels in "not swordsage" count for half, so 4 +1 = 5.

[snip] Yes, of course, my bad: I knew that, I just wasn't thinking as fast as I was typing

Also, your first stance in any adept class is required (check each of their descriptions) to be a 1st level stance.

The wording is actually "you begin play with knowledge of one 1st-level stance from any discipline open to you" (varying slightly, but they all start the same way).

This was not intended to apply to mutliclass martial adept classes, it's just unfortunate wording chosen because the class descriptions were written with the supposition that a martial adept begins at 1st level, hence the "you begin play" line. In other words, they weren't thinking it through If you're multiclassing into a martial adept class later on, you're not "beginning play". The ToB Q&A from questions asked of the Sage confirms this (albeit indirectly), CustServ confirms it and Rich Baker confirms it. However, the legend persists!

Full round action.

Incorporeal or gaseous creatures are immune to being polymorphed, and a creature with the shapechanger subtype can revert to its natural form as a standard action.

Changeling's a great social rogue with an awesome racial substitution level at 1 (10 + Int skill points, and it gets the x4 multiplier!), and as you note, allows entry into Warshaper.

Absolutely, Changelings are great.

If you do this, it's also only fair that you accept the partial base save rules, too.

Oh yeah, for sure, but you still get a boost from going into a class with a good save progression you didn't previously have.

 

[Persiflage]

And no, I wasn't trying to tag you... Why did you think so? I'd just ended up posting out of sequence and wanted to respond properly.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

So, no Dragonwrought Kobold shenanigans; you've got to be 21st level for an Epic feat.

Dragonwrought lets you get around this. You still can't get epic feat that require things you simply CAN'T have pre-epic, like 24+ skill ranks. But otherwise, you can get epic feats. In this case, the feat in question isn't insanely powerful anyway. And it requires you to be a kobold!

The wording is actually "you begin play with knowledge of one 1st-level stance from any discipline open to you" (varying slightly, but they all start the same way).

This was not intended to apply to mutliclass martial adept classes, it's just unfortunate wording chosen because the class descriptions were written with the supposition that a martial adept begins at 1st level, hence the "you begin play" line. In other words, they weren't thinking it through If you're multiclassing into a martial adept class later on, you're not "beginning play". The ToB Q&A from questions asked of the Sage confirms this (albeit indirectly), CustServ confirms it and Rich Baker confirms it. However, the legend persists!

It persists because that's the RAW, and frankly...dipping into adept classes later on is already pretty freaking sweet. I'm in favor of it even if it does go against RAI. Have any links from cust serv, Rich Baker, or the Q&A?

(Polymorph text)

Interesting. Normally it takes a Changeling a full round action to change forms, not realy sure which text would superseed which. That said, it says revert to its natural form as a standard. Most changelings I've played try damned hard to make sure no one ever knows what their "natural form" is, if you catch my drift. And if you're using Warshaper, you'd lose all the benefits if in your natural form, so probably still a better idea to spend a full round to become something else anyway.

And no, I wasn't trying to tag you... Why did you think so? I'd just ended up posting out of sequence and wanted to respond properly.

Because the post I quoted...which mysteriously changed from what I saw when I clicked "quote"... has a tag to someone else but seemed to be in response to me.

 

[TremorFang]

Wow. Thanks everyone. I will definitely be looking into the Swordsage, and the changeling. Thanks.

The reason from immunity to transformation, is that our wizard, basically likes to ruin things for whatever character I play. We'll be at 15th level, so he said he's going to pick polymorph any object. Which also means me. He would totally do it too. So I was looking for a way out, if he actually did it.

I may just deal with the low fortitude, because I am making a rogue / darkblade / dark creature (ala Continuous Collar of Umbral Metamorphosis). I know poison is difficult, but I love it. Especially due to the metapoison feats in the poison book.

Thanks everyone.