D&D 5E Capturing problem

[Bacon n eggs]

This is less a discussion, more a question. Sorry for the length...

Background: One of my PCs is a fighter, bound to guard the future queen of a land, she is a support NPC. Me and my player have talked about where he wants his character to go and we have agreed that there will be a cost: his sight. He knows nothing else on the subject. This has been months ago and my next session is when I plan for it to happen.

Situation: the final fight of this next session will consist of my PCs: a wizard, rouge, paladin, a hunter, and the fighter vs. My BB henchman, 5 shadar Kai. Knowing that my players are stacked with magical items and kind of OP (first campaign, learned my lesson) I set the entire stage against them. They will be fighting the shadarkai in total darkness save a group of bioluminecent plants (think avatar) which turn into flesh eating plants if daylight is used, which they will. They have to kill the plants to use light in order to take down the shadarkai.

The problem: this fight should be roughly 6 -8 rounds maybe a bit more. The battle will end when they can kill 1-2 of the shadarkai, the others will retreat into a number of archways that lead to the shadowfell which the PCs can not follow. In the time it takes to end this fight I have to forcefully take 2 of PCs, the fighter and another, mid battle and kidnap them into the shadowfell. How can I do this? Any ideas? Both PCs have 20 strength.

 

[Swarmkeeper]

This is less a discussion, more a question. Sorry for the length...

Background: One of my PCs is a fighter, bound to guard the future queen of a land, she is a support NPC. Me and my player have talked about where he wants his character to go and we have agreed that there will be a cost: his sight. He knows nothing else on the subject. This has been months ago and my next session is when I plan for it to happen.

Sounds good so far - shaping part of the campaign based on what the players want.

Situation: the final fight of this next session will consist of my PCs: a wizard, rouge, paladin, a hunter, and the fighter vs. My BB henchman, 5 shadar Kai. Knowing that my players are stacked with magical items and kind of OP (first campaign, learned my lesson) I set the entire stage against them. They will be fighting the shadarkai in total darkness save a group of bioluminecent plants (think avatar) which turn into flesh eating plants if daylight is used, which they will. They have to kill the plants to use light in order to take down the shadarkai.

Neat idea for a combat puzzle!

The problem: this fight should be roughly 6 -8 rounds maybe a bit more. The battle will end when they can kill 1-2 of the shadarkai, the others will retreat into a number of archways that lead to the shadowfell which the PCs can not follow. In the time it takes to end this fight I have to forcefully take 2 of PCs, the fighter and another, mid battle and kidnap them into the shadowfell. How can I do this? Any ideas? Both PCs have 20 strength.

Here's where it falls apart a bit for me.
Indicating that you "have to forcefully take 2 of the PCs", frankly, sounds like a railroad that is very likely, IME, to result in some raised eyebrows at the table.

If I were running such an adventure, I'd want to provide the party with a reason - and some limited ability - to go into the Shadowfell. A reason that doesn't involve me, as DM, forcing the story there but rather involves the party making that decision on their own based on adventure hooks I've laid out. I mean, you can certainly hope a grapple works by the luck of the dice - but if it doesn't, have a backup idea ready that gives them incentive to choose that path. And, if/when they don't choose it, go with the flow and come up with another direction for the adventure to take - perhaps one based on previous actions and words of the characters. Good luck!

 

[LordEntrails]

Yea, "have to" is troublesome. So is thinking that something (agreed) bad happening to a specific PC during a specific session is... also troublesome.

And then splitting the party... That's going to be interesting (because I didn't want to say troublesome again!), are you going to split the group into two play sessions? Or is half the party going to sit around and watch the other half play?

I'm not sure where to go with this, there are plenty of ways to get the party interested in going to the shadowfell, or even splitting the party mid combat with some of them following the shadar kai through a portal before it closes on the others. But controlling which ones go and which ones don't is near impossible.

 

[Bacon n eggs]

Yea, "have to" is troublesome. So is thinking that something (agreed) bad happening to a specific PC during a specific session is... also troublesome.

And then splitting the party... That's going to be interesting (because I didn't want to say troublesome again!), are you going to split the group into two play sessions? Or is half the party going to sit around and watch the other half play?

I'm not sure where to go with this, there are plenty of ways to get the party interested in going to the shadowfell, or even splitting the party mid combat with some of them following the shadar kai through a portal before it closes on the others. But controlling which ones go and which ones don't is near impossible.

So, prior to the arriving at the final fight they will run into a group of npcs who are from the shadowfell who warn them against going at all costs, they will make them aware of how the portals work: while they are portals to the shadowfell, you must know where the other side of the the portal goes in order to proceed through unscathed, otherwise you risk getting your body and soul wrenched between the world's.

In my campaign, I bent the rules of the shadowfell a bit. I made it to where depending on certain conditions time will flow differently there compared to the world that they are from. I won't risk splitting the party, it should happen like this: final battle of the session, kidnapping, end session. The next session will be a one shot for each character individually who I take into the shadowfell where they will be introduced to the BB and tortured. One of them will lose his eyes, the other will be turning into my double agent so that the BB can have eyes on the party. Afterwards the double agent will break them out and return through the portal where they came from "now knowing" where both ends of the portal leads they can successfully traverse it back through. Now as time flows differently here, at the end of the one shots, they will both come back after spending what seems like days being tortured, to the rest of the party as I left them at the end of the big fight. So when I get everyone together again, they will have a few new problems, a few new plot hooks, and they will have completed the mission, although in horrible shape, that I sent them on in the first place. They will be victorious, but will not want to go directly back into the portal because of the shape that they're in after escaping.

 

[Bacon n eggs]

Sounds good so far - shaping part of the campaign based on what the players want.


Neat idea for a combat puzzle!


Here's where it falls apart a bit for me.
Indicating that you "have to forcefully take 2 of the PCs", frankly, sounds like a railroad that is very likely, IME, to result in some raised eyebrows at the table.

If I were running such an adventure, I'd want to provide the party with a reason - and some limited ability - to go into the Shadowfell. A reason that doesn't involve me, as DM, forcing the story there but rather involves the party making that decision on their own based on adventure hooks I've laid out. I mean, you can certainly hope a grapple works by the luck of the dice - but if it doesn't, have a backup idea ready that gives them incentive to choose that path. And, if/when they don't choose it, go with the flow and come up with another direction for the adventure to take - perhaps one based on previous actions and words of the characters. Good luck!

Your right, have to is maybe the wrong way to phrase it. My objective as the BB henchmen will be to capture two of the party, the two strongest. I have thought about a grapple, and while I highly doubt they will ha e the dexterity to miss the grapple, they will have the str. To break the grapple on their turn. That being said, is there another way to kidnap the two strongest players?

 

[Shiroiken]

Drow sleep poison is probably your strongest bet. If they have the opportunity to coat their weapons, and you deliberately focus on the fighter, there's a descent chance he and another PC will fail. A Wand of Paralysis or two could also work, but you risk them falling into the PC's hands.

 

[Bacon n eggs]

Drow sleep poison is probably your strongest bet. If they have the opportunity to coat their weapons, and you deliberately focus on the fighter, there's a descent chance he and another PC will fail. A Wand of Paralysis or two could also work, but you risk them falling into the PC's hands.

Thanks a lot. I'll look into that

 

[LordEntrails]

I hope your players have agreed out of character to roleplay the torture to whatever level you are going to detail it. As well as to one of them becoming a spy. Inter-party conflict can be a great deal of fun, and it can also destroy a campaign and the willingness of the players to play together in more campaigns.

 

[J-H]

-Sleep poison as pointed out.
-Hold Person, Stunning Fist, and similar incapacitating/paralysis-causing effects
-Bigby's Hand is surprisingly good for grappling, as it has advantage on checks against Medium or smaller creatures. It has +8 on the grapple check with that advantage, or it can shove a target up to a distance of 5+(5*spellcasting ability modifier), so potentially a 30' shove to magic-hand-palmheel someone through an arch.

 

[Bacon n eggs]

Thanks a lot. I'll look into that

I hope your players have agreed out of character to roleplay the torture to whatever level you are going to detail it. As well as to one of them becoming a spy. Inter-party conflict can be a great deal of fun, and it can also destroy a campaign and the willingness of the players to play together in more campaigns.