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Ceramic DM - Spring 2005 (Late Bloomer) - We have a winner.

BSF

Explorer
Bibliophile said:
The file is straight text, some italics, some bold, some underline, but all within reason. Some of the text is in red as well, but again, within reason, and with a definite story reason.

I will probably treat it like all the other stories. Specifically, I will copy/paste the text into a text editor for my initial read through. After my initial readthrough, I start analyzing the story and looking for where the pictures are used. Sometimes that means I have to go back to the post and look for links, many times I do not.
 

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Macbeth

First Post
Unless Italics, Underlines, bold, and red color are preserved in your copy/paste, you'll have a hard time reading it, since there are many places where the formatting is the only thing that distinguishes one characetr from another. Granted, all of these are things that could have been done in a post, it just would have taken a while.
 


Macbeth

First Post
Berandor is right... if you really don't want the PDF, just use the text file. I read it from the PDF and I think it worked well there, and that there wasn't anything that deserved disqualification. the formatting is nothing beyond what could be done on the boards, it's just done more easily in these formats. I'd recommend reading it without copying/pasting. And it is in PDF, so it should be readable anywhere, any OS.
 

Hellefire

First Post
Berandor:

[sblock]
Quote:
'Cassie transported herself into Sharon’s mindscape. That was the good news.' - I would add something positive to this to emphasize it is good news.

The "good news" is that Sharon isn't gone yet. Cassie having transported herself to the mindscape is just a part of that thought. Or would: "...so Sharon's sould hadn't departed yet. That was the good news. Cassie had transported herself to Sharon's mindscape." be better?


My main problem with it was the lack of clarity on which part was the good news. With a VERY simple sentence, you can avoid specifying what you are refering to as 'good'. For example: 'I passed my exam. That was the good news.' Now even some simple sentences can be confusing, for example: 'I ate a warm breakfast this morning. That was the good news.' Is it good that you ate breakfast, or that you ate it in the morning, or that it was watm, or some combination thereof? If there was information around that sentence refering to eating cold food all the time or not eating much lately or never having time to eat breakfast in the morning, then it would be more clear. In the specific case of your story, I wasn't sure if it was Cassie's ability to transport in general, or her ability to transport into Sharon's mindscape specifically that was good, and why (is there a chance of transporting somewhere else on accident?). The 'good; part was refering to Sharon's mind still being there to have a mindscape. I would add something to make that more clear. 'If there is a mindscape, there must be a mind.' or 'Her soul must still be here.' or even just add 'was able to,' in order to emphasize that the good part came from the possibility that she might not be able to. I think adding why is a good idea too, in a lot of cases. Letting the reader figure that out for themselves is a good thing as well, but I missed the connotation myself until you explained it. Maybe just my sleep-deprived mind though :).


Quote:
'After a prayer to Zephyr, the west wind, Cassie had invoked the soul-joining spell. It had worked, so Sharon’s soul had not yet departed.' - Should be using past simple tense instead of past perfect. Generally perfect tenses are used to emphasize that one activity is completed, which leads to or explains another activity.

Since we're already in the mindscape, this whole paragraph has already happened. It's probably an awkward style, but is it still wrong then?


Quote:
'When the spell had taken effect, Cassie had found herself in this darkness, unable to see her hand before her eyes.' - Back to the past perfect thing.

See above :) it's already happened.
Past perfect is used to show that an activity is completed. It is generally used for timing. It is only necessary to use when emphasizing the time of something else happening, or emphasizing the completion of an activity. In all cases it must be accompanied by another activity or event that occurs afterward the completed activity (that's a rule part). When emphasizing, you should stick to emphasizing one thing at a time (that's a style thing). For example (about emphasizing, not about past perfect): That guy is amazingly strong as I found out in an extremely funny way. This is technically correct. However, most people won't be sure if you are trying to point out how strong the guy was or how you found out about it. Even if they can deduce from your next sentence which you were trying to emphasize more, you still end up sounding like an 8 year-old on crack. Now back to past perfect.

'After a prayer to Zephyr, the west wind, Cassie had invoked the soul-joining spell. It had worked, so Sharon’s soul had not yet departed.'

The first sentence is technically incorrect, because the clause holding the past perfect-tensed verb must be followed by another activity or event. In this case the prayer happens prior to the invoking. It could be 'After a prayer to Zephyr, the west wind, Cassie invoked the soul-joining spell.' This simply shows a sequence of events. Or, it could be 'After she had said a prayer to Zephyr, the west wind, Cassie invoked the soul-joining spell.' This shows a sequence of events and emphasizes the fact that Cassie said the prayer first (emphasizing that she felt the prayer was needed and must be completed to perform the second action).

The second sentence is also technically incorrect, for the same reason. In addition, it tries to emphasize two different events, which is very bad form (and may also be technically incorrect, though I'm not sure). It should be 'It worked, so Sharon’s soul had not yet departed.' This shows that it working was a direct result of Sharon's soul still being present.

'When the spell had taken effect, Cassie had found herself in this darkness, unable to see her hand before her eyes.'

Same as second sentence above. If it had been written 'When the spell had taken effect, Cassie had found herself in this darkness, and was unable to see her hand before her eyes.', it would still be incorrect from a style standpoint, but at least the second instance of past perfect would be followed by an affected result. It should be something like 'When the spell had taken effect, Cassie found herself in this darkness, and was unable to see her hand before her eyes.' or 'The spell took effect. Cassie found herself in this darkness, unable to see her hand before her eyes.' or even 'When the spell had taken effect, Cassie found herself in this darkness, unable to see her hand before her eyes.' Do NOT use two past perfect clauses in the same sentence unless they are at an even level (both happening simultaneously or independent of each other) and with a result that depends on both happening/being completed. For example: 'After I had finished my homework and Amanda had eaten dinner, we met for a movie.' There is a little leeway here, for example: 'After I had cooked and my wife had eaten we went to the party.' Obviously the cooking must have happened before the eating, but I am not emphasizing that my wife ate after I cooked and that we went to the party after she ate. I am emphasizing that after I cooked and she ate, then we went to the party. Does that make sense?

Hope this helps! I'll try to look up some different books which state 'official' rules, but don't time me on it. I already have a billion things to do.
[/sblock]

I hope that when my gf and baby and I get back to Poland, we can make a road trip sometime (or you can) and we can get together for a pint!

Aaron
 


BSF

Explorer
Actually, using any formatting to differentiate between characters is part of my concern.

Winter 2004 (January) Ceramic DM is the first use of a PDF for posting. (Other notable trivia - first contest with a poem submitted, and Sialia wrote a trilogy and won.)

If you look back through there, Sialia asked if there were any issues using a PDF. Mythago, the organizer for that contest, was fine with a PDF so long as it was straight text. Basically, it is OK to encapsulate the story in a PDF as a readable format for convenience.

As I was Sialia's competitor at the time, I remember it well. :) I personally did not object as I was confident that the judges would weigh the judgements based on content. I need to assure that I give the other competitors a fair shake. Even using colors in bbcode is not easy for everyone. So I would still copy/paste as I do with all the stories so I can have the same 'quality' readthrough.

It's nothing personal. But it is a judging critieria I feel I need to follow through on. If all the stories are equal in quality/enjoyment, then ease of readability becomes an issue. It shouldn't be a big deal overall though
 

Bibliophile

First Post
Sorry for it to have caused this much fuss. I would have done without the formatting, and found another way to achieve the same ends if I knew it would be such a big deal, I just thought that the bold/italics/etc provided an effect in differentiating the dialogue that was very fitting for the story.

I think the bold/italics/underline should copy over to text editors, unless you're using notepad or somesuch. The only thing that wouldn't is the red color of several lines near the end.
 
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BSF

Explorer
Bibliophile said:
Sorry for it to have caused this much fuss. I would have done without the formatting, and found another way to achieve the same ends if I knew it would be such a big deal, I just thought that the bold/italics/etc provided an effect in differentiating the dialogue that was very fitting for the story.

I think the bold/italics/underline should copy over to text editors, unless you're using notepad or somesuch. The only thing that wouldn't is the red color of several lines near the end.

Oh, don't worry about it causing a fuss. If it makes the story easier and more enjoyable to read, that's great. But one of the points we have always tried to reiterate is that formatting doesn't count for or against you. As a judge, I have to worry about that aspect. Especially since I have reiterated it in one form or another several times.

My preferred editor at the moment is Crimson Editor. It has a lot of the features of UltraEdit for a lot less of the price. :) Notepad works, but I like having the multiple tabs to switch between documents.
 

tadk

Explorer
My First Ceramic DM posting

Hello All,

Congrats to all participating. I plan to read the entries after I post this
Using the images in the first series, I started it Thursday, was out of town Friday to Sunday, finished it today. So only 2 days of writing time, just not within the limits.

If anyone would like to critique it, see if I am worthy to talk to you all, here is a link to it posted on the Kiln Fired Thread

http://www.enworld.org/forums/showpost.php?p=2344957&postcount=68

I could not figure out, swiftly, the way to link the images in. So rough as far as posting where the images go at. Hopefully you all can figure that out.
Hope that works. I do plan to work on it a bit more this week, wanted to post it, and then share it farther afield in addition..

Time to start reading
Tad
 

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