Characters never fall down -OR- Uncinematic combat

[Paul_Klein]

Something that bothers me with the d20 system (and probaby most systems I would imagine), is not that combat is unrealistic, but that it does not follow some cinematic rules.

By this, for the most part, I mean that character never suffer a big punch to the face, and fall on their ass in the process. Here's an example from my d20 modern campaign that really kinda burned me.

On of the PCs was standing in a helicopter, looking over the open door to see below them. Suddenly, someone who was hanging from one of the landing legs swung up into the helicopter, and in the process kicked the PC in the chest. The PC was unaware (thus, flat-footed), and caught totally by suprise.

Now, I felt that the PC should most definitly fall flat on his back from the shock and momentum of the kick. Unfortunatly, it's not covered in the rules. Yes, it would hamper the PC (he would need a move action to stand up), but it just makes more sense than him getting a massive, unexpected kick in the chest and simply remain standing.

I'm hope you understand what I'm trying to say here. What are your thoughts on this?

 

[smetzger]

What are your thoughts on this?

I fully agree, but I don't know how to fix it.

Best solution I have is to have someone get knocked down to a kneel whenever it makes sense but allow the person to get back up as a free action without provoking an AoO. Being prone in 3.5 is a very dangerous situation to be in, I wouldn't want to be knocking people prone willy and nilly.

 

[Aaron L]

If you intended to have him knocked down, the kick should have been a Bull Rush attack. It's all there in the rules to have things like that happen, you just have to try different things than the straight forward "attack"

 

[trilobite]

Heck, It's your game. If you want have the guy fall prone or at the very least have him make a reflex save or fall prone or OUT of the helocopter (if he rolles a 1). Don't feel chained to something you don't like. As the Game Master you can change things as you see fit, as long as the players understand and you don't constantly change stuff on them it should be fine.

 

[smetzger]

If you intended to have him knocked down, the kick should have been a Bull Rush attack. It's all there in the rules to have things like that happen, you just have to try different things than the straight forward "attack"

A Bull Rush doesn't do any damage. The kick did damage _and_ should have knocked this guy down.

Lets take another example. A Hill Giant hits a flying Pixie with his club. The Pixie should take damage and be sent flying back some distance, yet he just takes damage acording to the rules.

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

How about that? When your character rolls a critical hit, you have the option of multiplying your damage or perform some kind of stunt (like knocking down your opponents, breaking down their weapons, etc.)

 

[Inconsequenti-AL]

One GM I played with used 'cinema dice' for one campaign. Basically like the action dice from spycraft - even worked out how many you got/what size from their table.

You could spend them to get a nice crunchy +DX to a dice roll, or were allowed to spend them to bend the rules in cinematic ways:

Deflecting arrows mid flight. Pushing bystanders out of the way. Knocking a flying wizard out of the air with a chair. Etc. Etc.

Players had some. DM had some.

Worked really well for the game/style of gm-ing this guy had.

Edit: Tired. Brain not working.

 

[Umbran]

The pixie only takes damage because when the giant swings the club,he probably doesn't actually connect as he would with a baseball. The more accurate image would proably be him almost,but not quite, connecting, or getting the most grazing of hits.

Hit point damage does not necessarily represent full contact between the weapon and the target. The giant can "do damage" without having his club actually connect - all he has to do is get close enough so that the pixie must strain like mad to keep from being made into a home run

 

[Ukyo the undead]

A Bull Rush doesn't do any damage. The kick did damage _and_ should have knocked this guy down.

Lets take another example. A Hill Giant hits a flying Pixie with his club. The Pixie should take damage and be sent flying back some distance, yet he just takes damage acording to the rules.

Well, I dont se any problem with A Special Bull Rush That Also Damage Its Target.

 

[Inconsequenti-AL]

The pixie only takes damage because when the giant swings the club,he probably doesn't actually connect as he would with a baseball. The more accurate image would proably be him almost,but not quite, connecting, or getting the most grazing of hits.

Hit point damage does not necessarily represent full contact between the weapon and the target. The giant can "do damage" without having his club actually connect - all he has to do is get close enough so that the pixie must strain like mad to keep from being made into a home run

It's one issue that doesn't quite add up in DnD. Because if it works like that, then surely magical healing doesn't make much sense? Cleric can fully heal a normal person with a spell, but the very same spell only 'heals' a small amount of 'near miss' on a heroic fighter? Perhaps their god hates people with lots of hit points.

I prefer not to think about it.