D&D General Chris just said why I hate wizard/fighter dynamic

[Scribe]

I'm generally for bringing classes up not pushing classes down.

Thats the short path to power creep, in most games.

 

[Mort]

It's going to be magical, either way. It's just a matter of whether it's magical(background magic stuff) or Magical(on that list of questions). At no point is the ability to hop a mountain or slice a boulder in half from 30 feet away going to be martial(mundane), even if it doesn't fall under the list of questions that makes it Magic(with capital M).

Essentially, the martial PC gets so skilled that he transcends the mundane and enters the supernatural.

Exactly, and I think that's a great way to go.

 

[DND_Reborn]

All PCs or just the martial ones?

All, but since martials tend to have larger HD, they benefit more.

 

[Cadence]

Nothing new here, but trying to collect my thoughts.

Is it just that some of the inspirational sources are things that don't usually play well together for the long hall, but D&D makes us want to be able to have them all? And that there isn't a nice way to let people picture the low-power character reasonably continue to stand up against the high-power characters' BBGs without some plot shenanigans?

Say, LotR - Fafhrd&Mouser - Conan
vs. Xena - Wuxia - Percy Jackson - Black Panther
vs. Wakfu - Thor - Captain Marvel - Dr. Strange*

Sure, Hawkeye and Thor appear together in a lot of Avengers comics I love, but Thor isn't going to be afraid of Kingpin, and Hawkeye isn't stopping the Dark Elves or taking on Surtur.

So, is the way D&D serves all of them by having Boromir turn into Captain America turn into Hercules. And having young Hermione turn into Zatana turn into Dr. Strange.

*Your assignment of levels will surely vary some.

 

[Mort]

Thats the short path to power creep, in most games.

IMO and experience, fear of power creep (for fighters) is just another example of fighters not getting nice things.

 

[DND_Reborn]

Interesting, but the problem is combat if just too big a part of most games/campaigns.

I'm generally for bringing classes up not pushing classes down.

Yeah it is, but because of that wouldn't it be more impactful for the non-martials to feel how and when they become inadequate, so they understand the price they pay for their power is they can become ineffective later?

That was the trade-off in earlier editions. I know a lot of people want "it all" now, but that was part of what made playing a magic-user in AD&D so much fun. The challenge of surviving the lower levels so you could reap the harvest of power later on...

Now, you already have the power, and depending on your caster class you are just as good as a martial (for the most part) in tier 1.

 

[HammerMan]

IMO and experience, fear power creep (for fighters) is just another example of fighters not getting nice things.

yup "Hey it was power level 3 at PHB and wizard was 15"... but if you bring it up to 9 (still below 15) that is correction not creep.

 

[HammerMan]

That was the trade-off in earlier editions. I know a lot of people want "it all" now, but that was part of what made playing a magic-user in AD&D so much fun. The challenge of surviving the lower levels so you could reap the harvest of power later on...

2e was great for 'casters have trouble for 5 levels then start to just end encounters' but a lot of drawbacks that went away in all other editions after it did away with

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

I want my martial characters to be just that, martial characters. I don't want them to be magic users by another name. My solution is to throw so enough encounters at the group that the casters can do awesome things once in a while, martials can do cool things all the time.

I've come to accept the fighter is doomed to mediocrity (but they can do it all day!) The BMX Bandit fans have claimed the class.

That said, can we have a big boy martial, with narrative skill based powers (which cannot be replicated by others with a skill check) and able to go nova on low encounter days? I'm too old to run trash encounters that don't matter other than to eat up resources from the real heroes. Particularly with 5E's low lethality, the outcome is a foregone conclusion so I'd rather cut out the middleman.

 

[Scribe]

IMO and experience, fear of power creep (for fighters) is just another example of fighters not getting nice things.

Nah, I'm talking in the very general sense.

If something (Wizards? whatever) are busted, then nerf them. If Faction X in Game Y, is broken, dont buff Factions A, B, and C. Just nerf Faction X.

Power creep the whole game, and the underlying systems eventually break.