Cleric / Wizard

[Gray Lensman]

On the other hand, if you want to be mostly arcane but cast a few Cleric spells (healing perhaps?) then take the Arcane Desciple feat from Complete Arcane. You can choose a cleric domain and add all those spells to your spell list, choosing to memorize one of those per spell level in one of your normal spell slots. You use Wis to cast these cleric spells however so you can't dump Wis with this option, but you can cast healing spells as arcane wiz spells, so make your arcane wand of cure light, or an arcane scroll of healing spells etc.

@scott2978 , RUMBLETiGERs gonna steal one and I am gonna steal this one but for a Sorc or Wiz build later. I have GOT to go back and read that book again, that's two things I didn't pickup on.

@Gray Lensman , I know you've designed this thread specifically to work on a Wizard/Cleric build. However, the spirit of what it appears you are trying to make is a Arcane Caster + Divine Caster + Combatant. I'd like to recommend that there are other builds besides Wizard/Cleric/Mystic Theurge that can accomplish this. Fochlucan Lyrist has build help Here. The Chameleon PrC can sort of do this, but without access to spells above level 6.

@RUMBLETiGER , Not so much Arcane Caster + Divine Caster + Combatant
as just Arcane Caster + Divine Caster, just also trying to get combat abilities as high as possible as long as it doesn't interfere with the other two. That's why we (DM & I) came up with different Orders within each of the Priesthoods.

I am most definately looking for max ability with both spell types AND looking for as much Item Creation Skill as possible.

 

[Gray Lensman]

So far I have

Morvyn Silverhair, Male 1/2 Elf Cleric 2 / Wizard 1
AL = Nuetral Good

Domains = Knowledge and Trickery
Specialization = Illusion (eliminating Divination and Necromancy)

Knowledge Domain Spells make up for losing Divination School and Clerical Spells in general make up for losing Necromancy School. And Trickery Domain goes hand in hand with Illusion.

Armor = Leather
Weapons = Morningstar and Light Crossbow

Feats = 1st Skill Focus (Concentration)
3rd Still Spell (and Scribe scroll as Wizard Bonus)
(Rest of Feats would concentrate on Item Creation)

Skills = Other that the needed Knowledge (Arcana) and (Religion) needed for Mystic Thuerge all initial skills and level skill points would be spent on survival stuff like hide, listen, spot, ect. and concentratiuon of course.

Level Progression = C1, C2, S1, C3, S2, S3

Still Questioning = Magic Domain Granted Power: Use scrolls, wands, and other devices with spell completion or spell trigger activation as a wizard of one-half your cleric level (at least 1st level). For the purpose of using a scroll or other magic device, if you are also a wizard, actual wizard levels and these effective wizard levels stack.

Does this mean that as a cleric 4 wizard 4 if I use an item that effect depends on my caster level that I would use that item at caster level 6? And is it worth worrying about?

A character that can hang back and use spells to help the party by buffing members and confuse/distract the enemy. Adventures to seek knowledge of all things magical and supports himself by spending any downtime creating Magical Items for sale.

Darn here I go again thinking of just letting him have the quaterstaff and no armor but I hate to lose the little bit of protecting himself he has gained. hmmm.....

I know, I'll let him keep the clerical stuff until he aquires some magical protection THEN take him back to the staff.

 

[Dandu]

Just for the record, theurges in general are a bad idea because the extra volume of spells does not make up for the lack of power of lower level spells.

 

[Gray Lensman]

Don't you mean HIGHER spell levels?

I like trying different characters out and playing them for a few levels. That's why the one on one gaming. Then they become NPCs complete with story line for the DMs Original Campaign World. And, playing them out this way along with a bit of back story already in place means a more fleshed out, tested NPC.

There is gonna be an Elven Brother (Ranged Fighter) and Sister (Sorcerer) Set in Stone, NO Multiclassing but probably Arcane Archer and some PrC for the sister.

A married Dwarven couple (Fighter/Dwarven Defender and Cleric/War Priest) Set in Stone. Actually, when I went to catch the requirements for these they both catch at 7th level.

Gnome Bard/TBD if any. Suggestions?

Halfling Rogue/TBD if any. Suggestions?

The Triplets (Human Female Cleric, Male Ranged Fighter, Male Spiked Chain Fighter) Suggestions?

Human (or Elf) Female (Draconic or Dragon Blood) Sorcerer (or Wizard?). May take Dragon Disciple with this one AND I am supposed to be working on an Epic Prestige Class based on the old Silver Sorcerer Miniature (Although, At this Point, I am not SURE how taking the DD PrC AND having the Draconic or Dragon Blood Template already will work out).

And yes, other people will be joining in on the doubles and triples. Every Campaign World needs NPCs that can act as Guides/Sources.

Are ya with me so far?

 

[Tharkon]

To go back to the domains.

If the DM is ok with it, all is well of course, but the reason why Clerics of Boccob normally don't have the War domain is not because of their order or choice. It is because Boccob himself does not govern that domain.
The DM could of course say Boccob does have the War domain, and that Clerics of a particular order are known to choose that domain.

Oh, and Arcane Disciple is in the Complete Divine, not the Complete Arcane.

 

[scott2978]

Morvyn Silverhair, Male 1/2 Elf Cleric 2 / Wizard 1
AL = Nuetral Good

Domains = Knowledge and Trickery
Specialization = Illusion (eliminating Divination and Necromancy)

Knowledge Domain Spells make up for losing Divination School and Clerical Spells in general make up for losing Necromancy School. And Trickery Domain goes hand in hand with Illusion.

Armor = Leather
Weapons = Morningstar and Light Crossbow

Feats = 1st Skill Focus (Concentration)
3rd Still Spell (and Scribe scroll as Wizard Bonus)
(Rest of Feats would concentrate on Item Creation)

Skills = Other that the needed Knowledge (Arcana) and (Religion) needed for Mystic Thuerge all initial skills and level skill points would be spent on survival stuff like hide, listen, spot, ect. and concentratiuon of course.

Level Progression = C1, C2, S1, C3, S2, S3

Still Questioning = Magic Domain Granted Power: Use scrolls, wands, and other devices with spell completion or spell trigger activation as a wizard of one-half your cleric level (at least 1st level). For the purpose of using a scroll or other magic device, if you are also a wizard, actual wizard levels and these effective wizard levels stack.

Does this mean that as a cleric 4 wizard 4 if I use an item that effect depends on my caster level that I would use that item at caster level 6? And is it worth worrying about?

A character that can hang back and use spells to help the party by buffing members and confuse/distract the enemy. Adventures to seek knowledge of all things magical and supports himself by spending any downtime creating Magical Items for sale.

Darn here I go again thinking of just letting him have the quaterstaff and no armor but I hate to lose the little bit of protecting himself he has gained. hmmm.....

I know, I'll let him keep the clerical stuff until he aquires some magical protection THEN take him back to the staff.

First thing I notice is that you chose Divination as one of your prohibited schools. Strictly by the PHB, this is explicitly not allowed. Of course DM word is law though.

Regarding the Magic domain, you are correct that your effective Wizard level would be 6 if you were a Clr4 Wiz4. I would point out to you that all the way up until level 20, the Practived Spellcaster feat will do the same thing as that domain. When you are level 18 and you are Clr9 Wiz9 your Wiz caster level will be 13 (always round down) which is 4 levels, which Practiced Spellcaster gives you. One feat does everything this domian does, in other words, because every spell in this domain are castable by you already with Clr and Wiz levels. My advice would be to take a different domain that grants you a granted power that is something that fits your character concept and is special and unique, and spend a feat to take Practiced Spellcaster wich will give you more bang for the buck over the long run.

As for the character's role in the party, you can take your pick. Fill in a gap in the PC classes, become everyone's best friend buffing and healing, take a leadership position due to your high CHA, or just nuke. Your main limitation combat wise is your low HP, but using magic you can usually get away from danger as fast as you can get into it. Just don't try to be a fighter unless it's a last ditch desperation move because that's one thing you don't do well.

Scott2978

 

[Gray Lensman]

I knew from the beginning that it wasn't BtB. It is a campaign world in development.

We gave Corellon a Priestly Order, Protective Order, and Natures Guardian Order.

Moradin got the Priestly Order, Protective Order, and the Earthen Order

Yondalla was handed a Priestly Order, Protective Order and Trickster Order

Fharlanghn was even given a Protective Order (which guards the major bridges and such that the order constructs and charges toll on)

Ect., Ect., ......

We haven't finished them all yet and I'm fairly sure they won't all actually get done because some aren't being used or are being replaced by one from another pantheon or scratchbuilt.

Some are somewhat mostly written up (did I just say somewahat mostly... I think I need a beer) some are just thought of so far.

And it has been a blast!!

Well, I am off fishing, talk to you folks Monday, have a great weekend!

 

[Tharkon]

The reason why Divination can't be chosen as prohibited school, besides the fact it's considered a weaker domain choice, is that without Divination you can't cast Read Magic, and without Read Magic you can't learn any other spells.
This is also why Read Magic is a free known spell for all Wizards which they can prepare without their spellbook.

So even though DM's word is law, a good DM better give an explanation for this when allowing Divination to be prohibited.

 

[Gray Lensman]

First thing I notice is that you chose Divination as one of your prohibited schools. Strictly by the PHB, this is explicitly not allowed. Of course DM word is law though.

Since as a Cleric I CAN cast read magic this has been allowed, however it is now a moot point since I am not specializing.

Regarding the Magic domain, you are correct that your effective Wizard level would be 6 if you were a Clr4 Wiz4. I would point out to you that all the way up until level 20, the Practived Spellcaster feat will do the same thing as that domain. When you are level 18 and you are Clr9 Wiz9 your Wiz caster level will be 13 (always round down) which is 4 levels, which Practiced Spellcaster gives you. One feat does everything this domian does, in other words, because every spell in this domain are castable by you already with Clr and Wiz levels. My advice would be to take a different domain that grants you a granted power that is something that fits your character concept and is special and unique, and spend a feat to take Practiced Spellcaster wich will give you more bang for the buck over the long run. Snipped...

I missed this Feat and will be using it at first level instead of skill focus (concentration) for Cleric spells and again at level three for the Wizard spells, thankz.

The reason why Divination can't be chosen as prohibited school, besides the fact it's considered a weaker domain choice, is that without Divination you can't cast Read Magic, and without Read Magic you can't learn any other spells.
This is also why Read Magic is a free known spell for all Wizards which they can prepare without their spellbook.

So even though DM's word is law, a good DM better give an explanation for this when allowing Divination to be prohibited.

See above

Actually, While fishing Sunday, Cindy (the DM) and I went over this character and it has been finalized.

 

[Gray Lensman]

Done, to be played out a few levels starting tuesday

Morvyn Silverhair, Male 1/2 Elf Cleric 2 / Wizard 1
AL = Nuetral Good

Domains = Knowledge and Trickery
Specialization = None

Armor = None
Weapons = Staff and Daggers

Feats = 1st Practiced Spellcaster (Clerical Spells)
3rd Practiced Spellcaster (Wizard Spells) and Scribe scroll (Wizard Bonus)
(Rest of Feats would concentrate on Item Creation)

Since I will only have three HD in other levels I will only get a 3 caster level boost but that should help, at least on certain spells, make up for lack of level progession initially.

Skills = Other that the needed Knowledge (Arcana) and (Religion) needed for Mystic Thuerge all initial skills and level skill points would be spent on survival stuff like hide, listen, spot, ect. and Concentration / Spellcraft of course.

Level Progression = C1, C2, S1, C3, S2, S3 then Mystic Thuerge 1

Currently Adventuring to seek as much magical knowledge as possible before settling down at a place to call home to concentrate on Item Creation (remember the NPC angle)

Oh, and we decided that the NPCs in the new campaign will continue to advance as well.