Clerics can't heal (NPCs)?

[mach1.9pants]

4) Willful misinterpretation of a clear rule. Much rarer, but it happens.

Yeah, Bag'o'Rats *Rolls-eyes*

 

[Kraydak]

Do you have a problem with the fact that we openly state it, or that it's true? If the former, that seems strange. If the latter, I'd guess you're not much of a fan of any heroic-scale RPG. All of them have this aspect, even if they don't come right out and say it. The D&D game has had it since very early on, so it's certainly not a departure for it to still be true.

Actually, having thought about it, what heroic-scale RPGs with different NPC/PC rules are there, really? Previous editions of DnD *didn't* have it in anyway I understand it.

 

[Khur]

The real problem with Bag o' Rats isn't the player. It's the DM.

I'd start by saying, "Dumping the bag certainly provokes opportunity attacks . . ."

 

[mach1.9pants]

You seem to think you need PC classes to make NPCs special, unique, or as powerful as PCs. That's an assumption you've made, and it's wrong. The only thing most NPCs and monsters aren't, compared to PCs, is as complex. If you think you need that largely mechanical complexity to tell your story, the PH is full of options for you.

That is just, well (since I can't use cool, awesome et al) w00t!

 

[mach1.9pants]

The real problem with Bag o' Rats isn't the player. It's the DM.

I'd start by saying, "Dumping the bag certainly provokes opportunity attacks . . ."

I always thought that the bag o' rats was a hypothetical argument put forward to ridicule rules in a ridiculous manner. It never even crossed my mind that some one would actually use it in game

 

[Daniel D. Fox]

I do still think there's a contingent of folks who prefer their town guards to be 5th level fighters and their generals to be 10th level warlords who still react like unimportant NPC's most of the time.

Like, me.

But then again, I love the utter simplicity of how NPCs could be potentially handled. Meaning, the local artisan stat block only has the appropriate Skill notations, or I can reference a table in the DMG to build more well-rounded individuals on the fly.

That would be best methinks. One of the better implimentations of this was the levels 1-20 tables in the 3E DMG for generic classes. I hope this makes a return in the new DMG, since a lot of the real estate for magic items has been displaced to the PHB.

I'd like both options, really.

Cheers~

 

[Professor Phobos]

Frak that. I've already got a game where nobody is really unique, heroic, or special... it's called real life. I play games to be something special, not to transplant the day-to-day mundaneness into some fantasy world.

I agree wholeheartedly, though I'd add in a caveat about not necessarily being special or unique, but being in a special or unique situation is also fine. Call of Cthulhu is, after all, my favorite game. There none of the Investigators are anything special- I mean one might be a particularly good Accountant, but what makes him special or unique isn't who he is, but what he does. Walk into the haunted house, face down a Great Old One sanity intact, etc.

Also, what happyelf said.

 

[Khur]

I always thought that the bag o' rats was a hypothetical argument put forward to ridicule rules in a ridiculous manner. It never even crossed my mind that some one would actually use it in game

I've never seen it, but I've heard of bad, bad stuff. But where rules trump reason coupled with fun, the rules need some tempering. A Bag o' Win is what I'm looking for. (I already have a Bag o' Wind.)

Actually, having thought about it, what heroic-scale RPGs with different NPC/PC rules are there, really? Previous editions of DnD *didn't* have it in anyway I understand it.

I guess your understanding and mine are different. In my perception, old D&D monster books are full of NPCs. And even if we're talking about PC-raced characters, this remains true. Take the first sentence in the 1e MM entry on "Men." "Normal men have from 1-6 hit points each."

Sure, those entries are full of stuff about the leaders of bands of "Men," but even those guys have random armor, weapons, and spells. Similar to PCs, but different. That tradition is upheld in 4e, I'd say, only it might be even easier to make a reasonable band of bad guys in 4e.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

The number is very easy to remember? I'm guessing that the number is "1."

I suspect it is either 2 or 4. They can either heal up to half HP, or have enough to be full... once.


Fitz

 

[Cadfan]

3e solution for bags of rats:

Bag of individual rats -> Bag o' swarm of rats.