Cohorts - how do you handle them?

[Arnwyn]

What does the player have access to, full stats of the cohort, or something less?

It depends. Usually full access to all the stats. If it's someone the PCs have just met and is getting integrated into the party, then sometimes it's just basic attack/AC stats.

What about character creation for the cohort? Do you use the same rules as PC creation, or something else? Who creates the cohort, DM, player, or a joint effort?

All of the above. It's the same rules as PC creation. Sometimes I'll allow the player to create him/her (though rarely), sometimes the DM will (as there are some adventures in which a cohort can be found), and most of often it will be a joint effort (to fit campaign circumstances, etc).

How much control does the player have over the cohort, and when? From what I hear, many games just allow the player full control over the cohort, like a second player character. We will almost certainly go with something less than this, but the question is how much less.

Full control in combat, but is role-played as a distinct personality and character by the DM.

How are XP and treasure rewards handled/divided (especially if other than per the DMG)? Are the new XP rules for cohorts working out, or are you using something else?

Treasure is handled however the PCs want to - it's not the DM's place to interceed, IMO. Since the player who has the cohort wants him/her to be as powerful as possible, dividing treasure fairly hasn't ever been a problem.

For XP, I ignore the DMG and divide XP among the PCs and cohort(s) equally. Giving a lesser share of XP to the cohort is bogus, IMO. If the cohort helps as much as the other PCs (and IME, they have), then they get a full share of XP.

Especially concerning treasure, it seems like other players may get the feeling the the presence of a cohort takes away some of the party's treasure, almost like the player with the cohort is double-dipping. Any problems in this area?

No - my players realize that a cohort is helping them achieve their goals. They appreciate the extra set of hps.

What works and what doesn't -- DMing technique stuff, rather than rules judgments. What do you like about the system you use, and how would you change it?

I like the system I use because it takes a lot of the work off the DM's back. Role-playing the cohort is easy, and the player takes care of the grunt work of controlling the cohort in combat and bookkeeping with the character sheet. (And if a player can't control 2 simple characters - the DM has to do multiple characters all the time - then his/her competence level is inappropriate for my particular game.)

 

[Vahktang]

One of my players just took the leadership feat.
The way I'm going to run it is that she requests the classes, I supply them.
Cohort will NPC a level with the character.
Player will decide on the way to keep or find another.

But here's the big question: how do you all handle cohort making magic items?

More later,

Vahktang

 

[kigmatzomat]

What does the player have access to, full stats of the cohort, or something less?

I give them the character sheet. Most combats they run the cohort but I tend to provide basic direction as the cohort's general reaction ("It's big, but nothin' too special" or "Holy freakin' crap! I ain't goin near *that*!") and make sure the player reacts accordingly.

What about character creation for the cohort? Do you use the same rules as PC creation, or something else? Who creates the cohort, DM, player, or a joint effort?

Mmm. I usually do base creation using PC rules. Once the social interaction and "bonding" of the cohort is done I give the players the character sheet and a GP value and let them equip him. Naturally I keep veto power.

How much control does the player have over the cohort, and when? From what I hear, many games just allow the player full control over the cohort, like a second player character. We will almost certainly go with something less than this, but the question is how much less.

I provide the cohort's attitudes and basic personality. My players get a handle on it and generally autopilot the cohort within those guidelines (meaning when the cohort does scouting, goes on watch, etc). Valorous cohorts charge into battle, more conservative ones use tactics like spring attack or ranged weapons to see if it's worth getting into a slugging match.

I maintain constant personality override and when the players start to have the cohort do something inappropriate (usually through inattention) I refresh them.

How are XP and treasure rewards handled/divided (especially if other than per the DMG)? Are the new XP rules for cohorts working out, or are you using something else?

It's.... hazy. XP is pretty much whenever I feel like it, but I try to keep the cohorts a few levels back. Treasure is also a bit odd, but that could be because the one cohort is an awakened dog. Right now the player pays for the cohort's treasure out of his share but that's partially because the dog isn't materialistic. He get's fed well and often, stays warm, has his own armor, and can take most any squad of town guardsmen. Heck, Dowser generally considers the un-awakened riding war dog to be *his* cohort!

Especially concerning treasure, it seems like other players may get the feeling the the presence of a cohort takes away some of the party's treasure, almost like the player with the cohort is double-dipping. Any problems in this area?

Depends. If it is handled as an ultra-trustworthy hireling, yeah that turns into double-dipping. But if it turns into a full fledged party member that puts the Leader as first priority there's no grief. General guideline is if your cohort will only help you or help others when it directly helps you, no treasure. If the cohort will endanger themself for other party members as a matter of course, treasure.

This is the same reason the ultra-greedy rogue in my game will buy healing potions to carry around so he can heal the cleric. Every bit of loot that goes to the party-cohort ends up benefiting the party.

What works and what doesn't -- DMing technique stuff, rather than rules judgments. What do you like about the system you use, and how would you change it?

I'll have to wait and see. I think one of the other PCs is going to pickup up Leadership, as the party's NPC. After that I might change my mind. Or lose it, as the case may be.

 

[Shallown]

What does the player have access to, full stats of the cohort, or something less?

I only have One Cohort in my present game. He was intriduced and his stats etc kept secret (As much as any NPC) until the player who requested the cohort actually gotthe leadership feat. I ran the Pre-cohort as an independent NPC. Npw the Cohort is all the players character sheet and all.

What about character creation for the cohort? Do you use the same rules as PC creation, or something else? Who creates the cohort, DM, player, or a joint effort?

I leave that up to the Player. They usually choose what they would like. So For this cohort the player wanted an elven cleric of sometype. Some one who had knowledge skills outside what the party could provide. So I created a Mystic Thurge wizard/cleric of the God of Knowledge. He is mainly a healer/buffer/diviner.

How much control does the player have over the cohort, and when? From what I hear, many games just allow the player full control over the cohort, like a second player character. We will almost certainly go with something less than this, but the question is how much less.

Failry much complete but I maintain veto power and if the cohort is abused they leave and you lose the use of the feat. the reason being is it is a very powerful feat so the risk of losing the cohort balances it out for me.


How are XP and treasure rewards handled/divided (especially if other than per the DMG)? Are the new XP rules for cohorts working out, or are you using something else?

Xp - None I just level them up with the PC to keep them in line with the Cohort Table for leadership.
Treasure was a in character party decision. They opted even before he became a Cohort to give him a full share after he saved several characters butts in a fight. I adjust treasure given based on what the characters decide.


Especially concerning treasure, it seems like other players may get the feeling the the presence of a cohort takes away some of the party's treasure, almost like the player with the cohort is double-dipping. Any problems in this area?

Not really as I said above they decided that the NPC got a full share. Also they know I will throw a little more thier way for an even split. Double dipping would be more in line with alimited resource, though treasure is not unlimited it is regulated by me to balance the game. Extar people mean extra treasure. I see it as if you had 4 person party and two more players joined would you still gve out treasure (and correspondingly challenges) based on 4 people or 6.


What works and what doesn't -- DMing technique stuff, rather than rules judgments. What do you like about the system you use, and how would you change it?

I like letting the players have the choices. Mostly they trust me to creat for them. Tehy know bending of the rules will be done more often by me than allow someone else to do that. So far the two big NPC's in that vein are the Mystic Thurge and the 1/2 silver dragon wolf mount that aplayer has. I have a reputation for a certain cool factor that the players like as far as neat surprizes.
Also the players know if I create the character I have a little bit more emotional investment in them and might cutthem a break once in a while.

Later

 

[jgsugden]

I do not allow leadership or any other feat that grants cohorts. They are by far the most powerful/broken feats in the game. They nearly double a PC's abilities at little (if any) real cost. The added number of player controlled characters makes game balance more difficult and often results in more PC deaths. Remember: these feats are all optional feats - PCs are not entitled to them unless you give it to them.

If you feel you must allow them, I advise keeping the following guidelines in mind. Many DMs let players go hog wild and end upturning something that is already out of balance into a nightmare. The key is to remember that cohorts are more than a set of extra abilities. They are NPCs with lives of their own.

Make sure their ability scores are on par with the NPC ability scores listed in the DMG (ie; that their ability scores are generated so that they are no more powerful than the elite array: 15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 08).

Although loyal to their PC, cohorts should have lives of their own that include such things as families, organizations and jobs that require some attention by the cohort and may require him or her to spend time away from the PC or may place the cohort in difficult situations where he must choose between his PC and his family's best interests ("If I break you out of jail, the king will execute my family! What should I do?")

These cohorts are NPCs, though the player may control them at the DM's option. You should design the cohort. The player may specify a race, gender and class, but you should choose skills, feats and any starting magic items. Even though the player will be playing the cohort in most games, you should feel free to specify some aspects of his personality. The cohort should be designed as a self sustaining being, not a min-maxed power booster for the PC.

Keep in mind that the cohort should notice abuse. Unless the cohort has an unusual relationship with his PC (slave, worshipper, lover, etc...), most PCs should resign their post if the PC doesn't treat them fairly. Their opinion of fair treatment will be determined by their personality, but most cohorts should take off if their master doesn't pay them well, doesn't give them a decent share of treasure or puts them at high risk.

If a cohort dies, it should not go unnoticed by the world. If he had a family, that family might demand the return of the corpse. Heck, they might even want compensation for you getting their father/brother/son/etc ... killed.

If a cohort causes problems in the game by being too powerful, being too disruptive or by reducing the fun of other players (for any reasonable reason), don't be afraid to take the player aside, explain that the cohort is not working out and find a way to work it out of the game (and give the PC a replacement feat).

In my experience, cohorts, unless designed to be no more than Sancho Panza to Don Quixote, make one player happy, the rest of the players a little frustrated and the DM very frazzled over all the balance and planning issues that the effectively new PC creates. If the goal of the game is the most total fun that all the players (and DM) can have, I find that leadership is not good for the gander, even though the goose may get off on the extra power.

 

[orchid blossom]

I'm just in a Joe Blank-inspired happy Hornblower haze.

If a player wants a cohort, I generally ask them what class. Then I build the character myself. I'll role play it, but the player usually controls it in combat. We haven't had any problems with this approach.

This is generally how our group handles it with one major difference. Since our campaign is very political, many of the characters took Leadership. The DM asked us what kind of people we were looking for as cohorts, and then started introducing NPC's into the game that we could pick up as cohorts if we wanted. I just made 11th level, I've had Leadership since 6th level and still haven't taken a cohort. I do have followers though.

 

[Saeviomagy]

For XP, I ignore the DMG and divide XP among the PCs and cohort(s) equally. Giving a lesser share of XP to the cohort is bogus, IMO. If the cohort helps as much as the other PCs (and IME, they have), then they get a full share of XP.

How can that possibly work? It won't be very long before the cohort is the same level as the PC's...

 

[Victim]

In my experience, cohorts, unless designed to be no more than Sancho Panza to Don Quixote, make one player happy, the rest of the players a little frustrated and the DM very frazzled over all the balance and planning issues that the effectively new PC creates. If the goal of the game is the most total fun that all the players (and DM) can have, I find that leadership is not good for the gander, even though the goose may get off on the extra power.

Well, that doesn't have to be true. Some cohorts types, like a fighter in group with no tank, or the cleric who heals and buffs everyone, work fairly well. If the cohort is filling its own niche, or helps everyone in some way, then things can work out. However, in our group, one player likes to be a dragon riding paladin. So he spends a feat and spiffifies a class ability. No big deal. However, when other players lose out on XP and treasure so one guy can have a better horse, problems can occur.

 

[Brown Jenkin]

Our campaign has 1 Animal Companion and 2 Cohorts. The Animal Companion and 1 Cohort are handled excactly the same way with the other Cohort picked up for off-camera running of a spy network. General principles are followed but each is treated as needed.

• What does the player have access to, full stats of the cohort, or something less?

Both Cohorts and Animal Companions are open to the characters. This is a neccesity since the player is responsible for the cohort durring combat.

• What about character creation for the cohort? Do you use the same rules as PC creation, or something else? Who creates the cohort, DM, player, or a joint effort?

The Animal Companion and one Cohort were created from scratch by the players. The other was an NPC that latter became a Cohort so it was originally stated by the DM. The players do work with the DM on background so that the DM can resonably insert the character and can can include future plot hooks via the Cohort. All players have full future development rights. This could be justified in that the leader character can give orders on how the cohort is to train. It also takes some of the burden off the DM.

• How much control does the player have over the cohort, and when? From what I hear, many games just allow the player full control over the cohort, like a second player character. We will almost certainly go with something less than this, but the question is how much less.

The players have full control during combat but the DM can overrule any unreasonable actions. Outside of combat the PC can give orders on what to do but the DM has NPC control over thought, speach and actions. The player roll-plays the character while the DM role-plays the character. This relieves the DM of extra work in combat and the insider knowlege that goes with it, but prevents the Cohort from become a personality extention of the player. It might be possible for a player to successfully role-play two characters but that is asking a lot of others. This seems like a good compromise to me.

• How are XP and treasure rewards handled/divided (especially if other than per the DMG)? Are the new XP rules for cohorts working out, or are you using something else?

XP via 3.5. One of the few 3.5 changes I fully embrace as needed and successful.

• Especially concerning treasure, it seems like other players may get the feeling the the presence of a cohort takes away some of the party's treasure, almost like the player with the cohort is double-dipping. Any problems in this area?

Treasure is up the the party. This has not been an issue for us yet as the Animal Companion gets nothing, the secret cohort also gets nothing since the player is keeping this from the party, and the adventuring Cohort is a Rokugan Samurai so can spend xp to improve her weapons allowing the Cohort to maintain parity without a share of the treasure.

• What works and what doesn't -- DMing technique stuff, rather than rules judgments. What do you like about the system you use, and how would you change it?

This system seems to work well. The biggest issue I could see with player control of a Cohort in combat is that it does double the players actions in combat. This is not quite as extreme as it might sound at first since this is also the case for Animal Companions and Familiars since level 1. Since Druids, Rangers, Wizards and Sorcerers already control multiple "characters" durring combat why souldn't everone else be allowed this same feature of the game. As for the adventuring cohort it is a bodyguard for a spellcaster so its job is to stay with the spellcaster. If it ever left to fight in the front ranks instead of its job the DM would be perfectly justified in overruling that action.

 

[Isida Kep'Tukari]

The way I've done cohorts is I give the player the character sheet (I have to run two NPC party members in addition to everything else), but I run the cohort's personality. If I think the player has gone beyond the bounds of the cohort's personality, I will step in and remind the player of what the cohort would do.

One of the "cohorts" in my game isn't actually a Leadership-gained cohort, but rather a love interest. So she has to be treated a little differently, but luckily the player treats her like glass. Her actions are usually quite properly handled and I'm pleased with the results so far.