D&D (2024) Command is the Perfect Encapsulation of Everything I Don't Like About 5.5e

[Bacon Bits]

Nah. Just another entitled fan who apparently "found something better" but can't stop thinking about and bashing their ex.

As though the rest of us don't bash 5e.14. Or 3.x or 4e or AD&D or B/X.

There's almost nothing fans of D&D hate more than D&D.

 

[KYRON45]

As though the rest of us don't bash 5e.14. Or 3.x or 4e or AD&D or B/X.

There's almost nothing fans of D&D hate more than D&D.

Amen playa!!!!

 

[Not a Decepticon]

Nope, not the only kind of humor. It's just by faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar the easiest way to run D&D (at least for me). If I don't want that kind of mood in a campaign I'm going to run a different system rather than trying to stomp out the kind of mood that animated Honor Among Thieves, as that just is what D&D is all about for me. And I loved Honor Among Thieves. Perfect slice of D&D for me. Sure you can run D&D with any kind of mood imaginable, but some go along the grain of the basic assumptions of how D&D is set up and some run against it.

Yeah, I think this is a very irony-posoned, bathos-overdosed perspective. If you think d&d is effectively worthless as roleplaying game and any attempt at getting invested into the story or characters should be undermined with fart joke and laughed at, I think we want very different things from the hobby.

 

[Lanefan]

Although trial and error is a way to learn, I think the hostility to teaching DMs or explaining the base assumptions of the game is saddening

As a whole it think D&D (minus 1e and 4e) was and still is too chicken to describe the details of its base assumptions. Mostly to enforce DM freedom.

For example, the point of Command is either action denial, causing a disadvantage, or limited forced movement. Not damage nor long term effects.

Therefore this should be say.

"The spell fails if the target is undead, if it does not understand your command, or if the command is immediately harmful to it, cause indirect harm to it, or cause major loss to it after one turn"

So no "Renounce" to make a priest lose its magic.
No "Abdicate" to make a king give up their throne.
No "Give" to make the demon hand you its magic weapon.

Want those effects, create a new spell.

Why would I create a new spell when I've already got one right here that's suitable for the job.

"Renounce" will cause a priest to have a momentary crisis of faith (i.e. no spells for that round) but that's it.
"Abdicate" might cause the king to quit but next round he'd revoke his quitting (and call for the caster's execution!)
"Give" is vague enough I'm not sure I'd let it work, but if a better command word exists to get someone to hand over what they're carrying, why not?

I'm fully on board with the target having to understand the command. I'm not on board with all undead being immune, as some (e.g. vampires, liches) are quite capable of understanding and using language and thus should be Command-able. My rule of thumb would probably be if it has enough language capability to be able to cast the spell if it was a Cleric, then - language permitting - you can cast the spell against it.

Command is one of those spells that while maybe intended to be a trivial inconvenience to the target, can be and is so much more when circumstances allow.

 

[Micah Sweet]

For all the people that follow the so called "rule of cool" for what PCs can command an NPC to do, do the NPCs have the same option? If you can ask a monster to "jump" meaning they jump off a cliff, can an NPC caster do the same to a PC?

Because I've long had the policy that whatever the PCs do, so can their enemies. That's one of the reasons I prefer a more limited list, having been on the receiving end of what I felt was pure abuse of a first level spell.

Of course. Anything the PCs can do (which to my mind includes everything logically possible by the standards of the setting), the NPCs can too.

 

[Lanefan]

For all the people that follow the so called "rule of cool" for what PCs can command an NPC to do, do the NPCs have the same option? If you can ask a monster to "jump" meaning they jump off a cliff, can an NPC caster do the same to a PC?

Yes.

Because I've long had the policy that whatever the PCs do, so can their enemies. That's one of the reasons I prefer a more limited list, having been on the receiving end of what I felt was pure abuse of a first level spell.

Good for the goose, good for the gander.

 

[Lanefan]

Yeah, I think this is a very irony-posoned, bathos-overdosed perspective. If you think d&d is effectively worthless as roleplaying game and any attempt at getting invested into the story or characters should be undermined with fart joke and laughed at, I think we want very different things from the hobby.

And if the roleplaying at the moment happens to be of the characters telling each other off-colour jokes?

Because it makes sense that sometimes they would. I mean, think about it: they're in a high-risk environment and often expected to put their well-being and-or lives on the line, thus their letting off a little steam now and then via (among other things) some crude humour in their downtime seems quite fitting.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Err..psst

If Hasbro goes under within the next 5 years, there's no company ready to fill in the financial marketing gap.

Then your favorite game will slowly go out of business as well.

The hardcore scene always relies on the mainstream to bring in new numbers..

There must always be the LE.

To be fair, there are always gamers, and games don't have to be in print to be played. They're not really making more B/X, for example.

The industry may (or may not) need WotC, but the community, IMO, does not.

 

[Remathilis]

As though the rest of us don't bash 5e.14. Or 3.x or 4e or AD&D or B/X.

There's almost nothing fans of D&D hate more than D&D.

I quit playing Pathfinder 1e when 5e came out because I felt the system was far too hard to prep for and combat was a slog. I didn't then hang out on the Paizo forums and tell everyone there they are toadies and I wanted Paizo to fail. I moved on.

 

[Not a Decepticon]

And if the roleplaying at the moment happens to be of the characters telling each other off-colour jokes?

Because it makes sense that sometimes they would. I mean, think about it: they're in a high-risk environment and often expected to put their well-being and-or lives on the line, thus their letting off a little steam now and then via (among other things) some crude humour in their downtime seems quite fitting.

Most of the bathos joeks are supposed to be in-character too. And personally I'm sick and tired of seeing in all media the fear of comittment, the constant winking to the audience and laughing that anyone could take it seriously are insulting. The normal in-character jokes I can stand, but I'm sick of bathos for next 10 years.

And toilet humor is something I don't tolerate in session entierly. Burbing, barfing, farting, pissing or crapping aren't funny, they make me nauseated, so I don't want them at a table I'm playing at all.