Computers beat up my role player

[Gimby]

Likewise Monopoly. Especially those variants like Star Wars Monopoly. I enjoy putting on a "Darth Vader breathing noise" when I land on Endor.

Just because your options are limited, doesn't make Monopoly not a role-playing game.

Uh, bully for you? So I take it you agree with the bulk of my position?

 

[Gentlegamer]

Uh, bully for you? So I take it you agree with the bulk of my position?

Are you asserting that Monopoly is a role-playing game?

 

[Raven Crowking]

Uh, bully for you? So I take it you agree with the bulk of my position?

If your position is that Monopoly is a role-playing game, and that Madden Football is football, then I agree that cRPGs are role-playing games in the same sense that the aforementioned are true.

If not, I hold that a cRPG is simulating playing an RPG in the same way that John Madden is simulating playing football.

RC

 

[crazy_cat]

*snip*
While clearly CRPGs limit your freedom to act outside a number of limited options, a good CRPG will endeavour to present you with a large number of options - giving at least the illusion of freedom. Which is sometimes all you get in tabletop games. In return for that, you can play without needing to gather a large group of people, get the mechanics handled automatically and (often) an excellent story. It is a trade-off. To claim that you *cannot* roleplay in a CRPG is I believe a gross simplification.

QFT.

 

[ThirdWizard]

If not, I hold that a cRPG is simulating playing an RPG in the same way that John Madden is simulating playing football.

I think my "not a simulation of a simulation" argument upthread is better than your "is a simulation" argument, but then I'd better! But... does that mean you think CRPGs have more in common with Munchkin than they do with P&P RPGs? This isn't a trick question with some kind of "aha" follow up. I just wonder.

EDIT: Changed question. Somehow I asked a completely different question than I meant to!

 

[Raven Crowking]

I think my "not a simulation of a simulation" argument upthread is better than your "is a simulation" argument, but then I'd better!

Of course.....We must work hard to prevent the explosion/implosion of the Interweb!

But... does that mean you think CRPGs have more in common with Munchkin than they do with P&P RPGs? This isn't a trick question with some kind of "aha" follow up. I just wonder.

When I was a kid, we made "footballs" out of folded paper and flicked them with thumb & finger to score field goals. This is a simulation of football, but a very different kind of simulation than Madden.

The Munchkin simulation of RPGs is intended to be a fun simulation, where the fun is based on knowing that you are simulating the form.

The cRPG simulation is intended to be a fun simulation, where the fun (and sales) are based on convincing you that it is more than a simulation. Some do this better than others.

Different types of simulations, but still simulations. IMHO. YDMB.

 

[hexgrid]

Most people consider tomatoes to be vegetables and treat their actual classification as a fruit as an interesting bit of trivia.

This still does not prevent them from being dead wrong.

They aren't wrong. You're insisting on one specific definition of the word vegetable, which in this case doesn't accurately describe how the word is used.

Try this definition, for example:

vegetable, veggie, veg (edible seeds or roots or stems or leaves or bulbs or tubers or nonsweet fruits of any of numerous herbaceous plant)

 

[ThirdWizard]

When I was a kid, we made "footballs" out of folded paper and flicked them with thumb & finger to score field goals. This is a simulation of football, but a very different kind of simulation than Madden.

I've done that at work. Hit a girl over a cubicle once. It was kinda like being a kid.

 

[Gimby]

If your position is that Monopoly is a role-playing game, and that Madden Football is football, then I agree that cRPGs are role-playing games in the same sense that the aforementioned are true.

If not, I hold that a cRPG is simulating playing an RPG in the same way that John Madden is simulating playing football.

RC

So, that would be the opposite of what I actually said, right?

Lets try this again.

Assume I'm playing, for example, Baldurs Gate. As I play, I make choices, explore areas, kill things and take thier stuff. I do this through the medium of a simulation, in this case generated and maintained by the computer.

I then go away and play D&D with my friends. As I play, I make choices, explore areas, kill things and take thier stuff. I do this through the medium of a simulation, in this case generated and maintained by the DM.

In both cases, I am simulating being an adventurer. In neither case am I actually being an adventurer (no, not even when I LARP).

If I play a CRPG I am not simulating the experience of actually playing a table top RPG. There is no arguing over whether a die is cocked. There is no having to hunt for my character sheet after loosing it (again). I don't have to actually roll the dice myself. The screen does not show me sitting around a table laden with books, dice and snacks.

A CRPG is not a simulation of a simulation (unless you are on Second Life or the Sims or something).

So, taking the risk of repeating myself to clarify in terms of your analogy (using proper football):

Football=Adventuring
Subbuteo=TTRPG
FIFA 200X=CRPG

Clear? Or do I need to go over it again

 

[Raven Crowking]

Assume I'm playing, for example, Baldurs Gate. As I play, I make choices, explore areas, kill things and take thier stuff. I do this through the medium of a simulation, in this case generated and maintained by the computer.

I then go away and play D&D with my friends. As I play, I make choices, explore areas, kill things and take thier stuff. I do this through the medium of a simulation, in this case generated and maintained by the DM.

However, when you say "I make choices" in both games, the terms are not co-equal.

Assume I'm playing, for example, Madden Football. As I play, I make choices, try to score, and hope to win. I then go away and play football with my friends. As I play, I make choices, try to score, and hope to win. Same thing, then, right?

If I play a CRPG I am not simulating the experience of actually playing a table top RPG. There is no arguing over whether a die is cocked. There is no having to hunt for my character sheet after loosing it (again). I don't have to actually roll the dice myself. The screen does not show me sitting around a table laden with books, dice and snacks.

If I play Madden Football, I am not simulating the experience of actually playing football. There is no arguing over whether a call is justified. There is no smell of sweat. I don't have to actually throw the football myself.

Madden Football, therefore, is not a simulation of football.

Clear? Or do I need to go over it again.

Yours is clear, merely incorrect (IMHO, of course).


RC