Confirming Criticals

[Tyrion]

When rolling to confirm a critical, it is my understanding that a natural 20 on the confirmation roll is not an automatic hit. My question is, is a natural 1 an automatic miss on the confirmation roll?

 

[durath]

I just re-read the "critical hits" section of the PHB and I can't find anything that states that a natural 20 on the confirmation roll wouldn't be an automatic hit. Is this in the F.A.Q. perhaps?

I would therefore assume that a natural 1 would be a miss on the confirmation roll and you would not score a crit.

 

[Caliban]

When rolling to confirm a critical, it is my understanding that a natural 20 on the confirmation roll is not an automatic hit. My question is, is a natural 1 an automatic miss on the confirmation roll?

A natural 20 on any attack roll is an automatic hit (unless the target has concealment), including the confirmation roll. (If you need a natural 20 to the target in the first place, the only way you will score a crit is to get a natural 20 on the confirmation roll as well.)

A natural 1 on any attack roll is an automatic miss, and in the case of a confirmation roll this simply means you do not score a critical.

See the PHB, page 123, critical hits.

 

[Crothian]

The optional rule of 20=30 and 1=-10 really clears up things like this. I like it and use it in all my games.

 

[Tome]

In my game a natural 20 on a critical confirmation followed by an additional D20 hit roll is an instant death blow. Anyone who can roll two natural 20s and a normal hit in a row deserve to kill the thing they are fighting.

I have to admit that the 20=30 and 1=-10 does sound like a good rule though. It would take away the possibility of a gnome with a +1 short sword killing a great wyrm with a single lucky swing (even if it was a sneak attack).

 

[Artoomis]

I really like the 20=30 and 1=-10 rule, too, though we don't use it in our game.

There are times when you just don't miss, or just don't hit (or the same for saving throws).

I just wish I could talk our group into using that rule.

*sigh*

 

[Belares]

The 20=30 and 1=-10 is interesting and would like to see it in use. According to what I have seen in PHB and DMG a "20" is always a hit and a "1" is always miss. The optional rule of rolling a second 20 and it being a automatic kill is as I said optional and can cause a lot of problems.

This is according to SRD "Critical Hits"
When a character makes an attack roll and gets a natural 20, the character hits regardless of the target's AC, and the character has scored a threat. The hit might be a critical hit (or "crit"). To find out if it's a critical hit, the character immediately makes a critical roll — another attack roll with all the same modifiers as the attack roll the character just made. If the critical roll also results in a hit against the target's AC, the character's original hit is a critical hit. If the critical roll is a miss, then the character's hit is just a regular hit.
A critical hit means that the attacker rolls for damage more than once, as indicated by the weapon description for the weapon that scored the threat, with all the attacker's usual bonuses, and add the rolls together to get total damage.
Exception: Bonus damage represented as extra dice is not multiplied when a character score a critical hit.

But there is a section on combat basics that says "BASIC TASK RESOLUTION SYSTEM
These rules assume a standardized system for determining the success or failure of any given task. That system is:
d20 + Modifiers vs. Target Number
The Modifiers and Target Number are determined by the type of task.
If the result of the d20 roll + the Modifiers equals or exceeds the Target Number, the test is successful. Any other result is a failure.
A "natural 20" on the die roll is not an automatic success. A "natural 1" on the die roll is not an automatic failure.

This is for skills i believe and not combat so there is your difference you may have seen.

 

[kreynolds]

This is for skills i believe...

Yup. Thus the "BASIC TASK RESOLUTION SYSTEM" title.

 

[AuraSeer]

AFAIK the confirmation roll is always made with the same modifiers and rules as the original attack roll. So if you consider a 20 on the attack to be an automatic hit, a 20 on the confirmation roll would automatically confirm the crit. If you use the 20/30 rule instead, then apply that to both rolls equally.

 

[kreynolds]

When rolling to confirm a critical, it is my understanding that a natural 20 on the confirmation roll is not an automatic hit. My question is, is a natural 1 an automatic miss on the confirmation roll?

No. After reading Deities & Demigods, you'll also notice that not only can a god automatically hit with every single attack no matter what, but he still must "roll" to confirm his critical hit. The reason these gods autohit with every attack is because of a neat little divine power that maximizes all of their attack rolls, saving throw rolls, and skill check rolls. This power doesn't apply when they roll to confirm their critical hit. Why? Because if it did apply, you wouldn't need to roll as he automatically got a 20 on his confirmation roll.

In short, when confirming a crit, a 1 is a 1 and a 20 is a 20, nothing more, nothing less. Besides, nowhere on page 123 does it state that rolling a nat 20 or 1 on a confirmation roll results in auto-failure/success. Just my opinion.