Converting Epic Level Creatures

Nookie · Nov 14, 2012

I don't think he should be immune to imprisonment sense in the adventure he is imprisoned somehow.

freyar · Nov 14, 2012

Yes, let's drop the immunity to imprisonment and banishment. Maybe give him a good save bonus vs those to make it a difficult task. Or something like that.

Cleon · Nov 15, 2012

freyar said:
Yes, let's drop the immunity to imprisonment and banishment. Maybe give him a good save bonus vs those to make it a difficult task. Or something like that.

He's already got immunity to imprisonment type effects from his Beyond Time And Space SQ.

The module says Ythog-Nthlei "lies in an enchanted slumber", so what he's vulnerable to is sleep effects.

I'm presuming the "imprisonment" refers to barriers meant to stop other folk breaking in to wake him up, he seems to burst out of them pretty easily.

Nookie · Nov 15, 2012

good point Cleon.

Cleon · Nov 16, 2012

Nookie said:
good point Cleon.

Okay, so we're dropping the immunity to sleep from the Draeden's list together with immunities that are already covered by Ythog-Nthlei's existing SQs.

Anything else we want to make him non-immune to?

Nookie · Nov 17, 2012

Cleon said:
Okay, so we're dropping the immunity to sleep from the Draeden's list together with immunities that are already covered by Ythog-Nthlei's existing SQs.

Anything else we want to make him non-immune to?

I think we are good

Cleon · Nov 17, 2012

Nookie said:
I think we are good

I think we can cut out the energy immunities, but leave him immune to disintegration.

That would turn the Draeden's immunities to...

Immunities: Ythog-Nthlei is immune to polymorphing, petrification, or any other attack that alters his form. Any shape-altering powers he might have work normally on himself. He is immune to mind-affecting effects (charms, compulsions, phantasms, patterns, and morale effects). His Beyond Nature and Beyond Time and Space abilities means Ythog-Nthlei cannot be affected by effects that imprison or banish him. Such effects include banishment, binding, dimensional anchor, dismissal, imprisonment, repulsion, soul bind, temporal stasis, trap the soul, and turning and rebuking.

Ythog-Nthlei is not subject to energy drain, ability drain, or ability damage, disease and poison, stunning, paralysis, and death effects. Ythog-Nthlei is also immune to damage from disintegration.

freyar · Nov 23, 2012

How does that stack up compared to a demon lord? Seems like a lot. It's certainly more than the 3.5e demon lords we have in the CC.

Cleon · Nov 23, 2012

freyar said:
How does that stack up compared to a demon lord? Seems like a lot. It's certainly more than the 3.5e demon lords we have in the CC.

It's quite a bit more than what a standard Demon Lord has, assuming you're not using the option of treating them as very low-rank divine creatures. That gives them a wide range of extra immunities as part of their divine characteristics.

e.g. a standard manifestation of Obox-Ob has immunity to disease, mind-affecting, poison, but if it's a rank 0 "Quasi-Deity" it adds immunity to transmutation, energy drain, ability drain and ability damage.

Even Demogorgon only has immunity to immunity to electricity and poison in most of his 3E incarnations, and all tanar'ri get those immunities as standard. The "Demon Ruler Avatar" stats of Demogorgon from Vaults of Pandius that is based on the Immortals Set version of the Prince of Demons has immunity to ability damage, ability drain, energy drain, disease, insta-death effects, paralysis, petrification, fear, all types of scrying and the effects of unnatural aging.

freyar · Nov 26, 2012

Yeah, that's kind of my point. I would think Ythog-Nthlei should have great immunities but more on par with the "standard" avatar demon lords/archdevils as opposed to the divine versions. After all, he's on the Prime Material and has been sleeping for eons. It seems he'd be a bit weak. Let's give him the "Beyond" abilities as well as immunity to energy drain. And that should probably be it.