Converting "Real World" Animals and Vermin

[Cleon]

Well, compared to our chimp, 4HD and Con 14-16 seems like a reasonable place to start.

OK, I'd start by Advancing our chimp to Large and giving it 4 Hit Dice.

I'd go for Con 14 since (a) I don't believe real-world gorillas are any more disease resistant than chimps and (b) that's what the SRD Ape does. I'd also make its Slams the primary attack, for similar reasons.

Oh, and if I remember correctly adult gorillas aren't very fast climbers, so I'd drop its Climb speed to 10.

Since it's got AC6 in the 2E version, I'll top up its Natural Armour to match.

We end up with something very similar to the SRD Ape.

Are we leaving it its Bonus Multiattack, or do we make the big ape pay for it?

Oh, and I thought we'd reluctantly decided to drop the Chimp's Int to 2, but it's still Int 6 in the stats.

Suggested Gorilla:
Gorilla
Large Animal
Hit Dice: 4d8+8 (26 hp)
Initiative: +1
Speed: 30 ft. (6 squares), climb 10 ft.
Armor Class: 14 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +4 natural), touch 10, flat-footed 13
Base Attack/Grapple: +3/+14
Attack: Slam +7 melee (1d6+6)
Full Attack: 2 Slams +7 melee (1d6+6) and bite +5 melee (1d6+3)
Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Fierce grappler
Special Qualities: Low-light vision, poor swimmer, scent
Saves: Fort +6, Ref +5, Will +2
Abilities: Str 23, Dex 13, Con 14, Int 6, Wis 12, Cha 7
Skills: Climb +13, Listen +5, Spot +5, Survival +4
Feats: Alertness, Multiattack (B or regular?)
Environment: Warm forests

Note: I put its extra 2 skill points in Listen & Spot.

 

[Cleon]

Now for further tweaking, I'd be tempted to reduce the Advanced Chimp version's Slam damage, since the 2E version has fists that do half the damage of its bite (1-6 versus 1-3). So I'm thinking we should drop Slam to 1d4. I may even reverse my initial stance and make its bite its primary attack, thus further differentiating it from the SRD Ape, which if it is anything like the old AD&D Carnivorous Ape would have talon-like nails instead of a gorilla's blunt fingernails.

Suggested Gorilla (Mark 2)
Large Animal
Hit Dice: 4d8+8 (26 hp)
Initiative: +1
Speed: 30 ft. (6 squares), climb 10 ft.
Armor Class: 14 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +4 natural), touch 10, flat-footed 13
Base Attack/Grapple: +3/+14
Attack: Bite +7 melee (1d6+6) or slam +7 melee (1d4+6)
Full Attack: bite +7 melee (1d6+6) and 2 slams +5 melee (1d4+3)
Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Fierce grappler
Special Qualities: Low-light vision, poor swimmer, scent
Saves: Fort +6, Ref +5, Will +2
Abilities: Str 23, Dex 13, Con 14, Int 6, Wis 12, Cha 7
Skills: Climb +13, Listen +5, Spot +5, Survival +4
Feats: Alertness, Multiattack (B or regular?)
Environment: Warm forests

 

[Shade]

I've fixed the chimp's Int. Thanks for catching it.

What do the rest of you think on making the bite primary?

 

[demiurge1138]

For the gorilla, slams primary, bite secondary, no need for Multiattack

Also, Shade, watch for Cleon's continued Int 6 tricks! Do not fall for his traps!

 

[Cleon]

For the gorilla, slams primary, bite secondary, no need for Multiattack

That works to, and is consistent with the SRD Ape/Dire Ape. I did like the idea of switching things around a bit to make the Gorilla more different from the 3E's official Large primates.

Also, Shade, watch for Cleon's continued Int 6 tricks! Do not fall for his traps!

Ah, but if I trick Shade into lowering his Int to 2 he'll be even more likely to fall for my traps!

 

[freyar]

Hmmm, I'd just imagine a gorilla would slam first and bite second, though.

Cleon, I hope Pathfinder changes that Int rule for you.

 

[demiurge1138]

Yeah, gorillas aren't generally known for biting. Chimps certainly are (what with all of the stories in the news these days about captive chimps lashing out), but gorillas?

 

[Shade]

Also, Shade, watch for Cleon's continued Int 6 tricks! Do not fall for his traps!

Ah, but if I trick Shade into lowering his Int to 2 he'll be even more likely to fall for my traps!

Shade does not speak or understand any languages.

<makes Will save, snaps out of it>

Added to Homebrews.

 

[freyar]

2nd feat Power Attack?

CR 2 or 3? Can't quite decide.

 

[Cleon]

2nd feat Power Attack?

CR 2 or 3? Can't quite decide.

Power Attack works for me.

I just realized I miscalculated its Grapple. Should be +15, not +14 if you include its Fierce Grappler ability.

The damage hasn't been upgraded from the Chimp - I think Slam +8 melee (1d6+6), Bite +3 melee (1d6+3) would do.

Oh, and Climb should be at least +14. (8 from racial, 6 from Strength)

That's assuming we keep the Str 23. There was talk of dropping it to Str 21, the same as the SRD Ape, which would make it grapple +14, slam +7 melee (1d6+5), bite +2 melee (1d6+2), Climb +13.