Converting "Real World" Animals and Vermin

[Cleon]

The physical ability scores from the 3.0 CC version don't look bad, actually, though I could bump the Con to 27 if you prefer.

I don't mind either way.

Both the Enworld 3.0's Con 25 and the Huge-ified Stormwrack Snapper's Con 27 are higher than our Giant Sea Turtle conversion and the SRD Dragon Turtle.

Which did you prefer?

I guess it's better to follow the 3.0 conversion since this is supposed to be an 3.5 update.

A 4d6 bite sounds good!

That we can agree on.

I'll update the Giant Snapping Turtle Working Draft.

 

[Cleon]

Okay, we need to settle on an Armor Class. The original monster has a quite impressive AC 0, the same as an AD&D Dragon Turtle.

The SRD Dragon Turtle has AC 25, so I suppose our Giant Snapper ought to too.

That'd require a +19 natural armour bonus with the Working Draft's current Size and Dex.

 

[Cleon]

What Reach do you fancy for its bite attack. The AD&D Giant Snapper's "long neck" gives it a 10 foot reach while the BECMI version has a 30 foot reach.

I'm inclined to make it 20 ft., since (a) it's the average of the two, and (b) if we advance the Giant Snapper to 20 HD it'll become Gargantuan and have a 30 ft. bite reach like the BECMI version.

 

[freyar]

I can agree to all that.

Are fortification and withdraw just there from copy-paste, or do you want them both? Given I've seen snapping turtles "clam up" often enough, I'd probably go for both.

 

[Cleon]

I can agree to all that.

Updating the Giant Snapping Turtle Working Draft.

Are fortification and withdraw just there from copy-paste, or do you want them both? Given I've seen snapping turtles "clam up" often enough, I'd probably go for both.

I was planning to keep them. Snapping Turtles have tough shells, after all.

 

[freyar]

Yeah, I'd keep them both also.

Put all the ranks in Spot?

 

[Cleon]

Yeah, I'd keep them both also.

Put all the ranks in Spot?

Well the Stormwrack Snapping Turtle has all its skill ranks in Spot, but I'm not sure that a Snapping Turtle actually has that good eyesight.

Sea Turtles have good vision, but they live in clear ocean water. Snappers often live in swamps and mud-clouded lake bottoms. Don't they use smell, hearing, and "feel" to find prey and navigate around at least as much as eyesight?

I'm inclined to put 5 ranks in Spot and 8 in Listen, for total bonuses of +6 and +9 respectively.

 

[freyar]

Sure, that'll do.

You know, I was going to suggest Imp Crit for one of the feats, but I think I'd rather give it an Augmented Critical SA instead. Snapping turtles have really nasty bites (can take your hand off easily)! What do you think?

 

[Cleon]

Sure, that'll do.

Updating the Giant Snapping Turtle Working Draft.

You know, I was going to suggest Imp Crit for one of the feats, but I think I'd rather give it an Augmented Critical SA instead. Snapping turtles have really nasty bites (can take your hand off easily)! What do you think?

I did toy with the idea of giving them Augmented Critical and/or the Sever Limb special attack we came up with for the Nikt'oo but decided against it in the end.

The Stormwrack 3E Snapping Turtle doesn't have a high critical and the only special attacks earlier versions had is automatic bite damage, swallow whole, and surprise.

Dang it, I forgot about the Surprise.

We should either give them a really hefty racial bonus to Hide in swamps (possibly with a "bonus when partially submerged" like the SRD Crocodile) or a Camouflage ability like we've given Big Daddy Turtle.

For the feats, I'd be content with just Improved Critical, likely with Weapon Focus (bite) [like the Stormwrack Snapping Turtle], Endurance [like our CC Giant Sea Turtle] and Improved Initiative [to represent their "shoot out neck quickly" trick] for the other feats.

Blind-Fight might suit them too, for hunting in murky swamp waters, but it seems surplus to requirements.

 

[freyar]

I like the Crocodile-like Hide bonus, I think. And those feats appeal.

I like the advancement you list that ends with Gargantuan at 30HD.

CR 7 seems about right.