Cooperative Item Creation question.

[Lord Pendragon]

I've never personally used the item creation rules, so I'm not solidly familiar with them. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Could a 4th-level wizard (with the Scribe Scroll feat) and a 4th-level paladin cooperate to create a scroll of a 1st-level paladin spell? If so, would the caster level of the scroll be determined by the creator (wizard) or caster of the spell (paladin)?

Also, I'm assuming that if the caster level is determined by the paladin, then the caster level would be 2, since although a paladin needs to be 4th-level to cast a 1st-level spell, his caster level at 4th-level is only 2. Correct?

 

[Hypersmurf]

Yes, they can cooperate, and yes, the caster level would be 2, but you'd end up with an unusual scroll - an arcane scroll of Cure Light Wounds, which neither the wizard nor the paladin could use, but a bard could. Or an arcane scroll of Divine Favor, which nobody could use, without Use Magic Device...

-Hyp.

 

[Thanee]

Why would it be an arcane scroll?
The magic inscribed is pretty clearly divine.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Thanee]

About the caster level, it would be somewhere between the minimum you need to cast the spell (1 in this case) and the lowest of the maximum caster level of the participants.

That is, the paladin has a caster level of 2 (which is lower than the wizard's 4), so the caster level could range between 1 and 2 here.

The wizard has to spend the XP.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Starglim]

The spell that you inscribe is the spell that "you" know, that is, the spell that the paladin knows, a divine spell of Cure Light Wounds.

The situation is slightly complicated by this text:

The type of scroll a character creates is also determined by his or her class.

But the paladin is also one of the creators of the scroll, so between them they can decide whether to create an arcane or divine scroll.

If the spell that is scribed must be arcane, then it can't be scribed at all, because neither creator knows the arcane version of Cure Light Wounds.

 

[Thanee]

That could very well be, that it is simply impossible to do this way.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Lord Pendragon]

Yes, they can cooperate, and yes, the caster level would be 2, but you'd end up with an unusual scroll - an arcane scroll of Cure Light Wounds, which neither the wizard nor the paladin could use, but a bard could. Or an arcane scroll of Divine Favor, which nobody could use, without Use Magic Device...

-Hyp.

Since the spell in question is expended in the scribing process but not actually cast, and the energy transferred to the scroll, I had thought that whatever type of magic was being cast would be transferred to the scroll. So the paladin cooperating with the wizard would create a divine scroll of Cure Light Wounds, but a bard cooperating with the wizard would create an arcane scroll of Cure Light Wounds.

If the PC with the feat, rather than the PC casting the spell, determines the nature of the item then it does indeed look problematic.

 

[Hypersmurf]

If the spell that is scribed must be arcane, then it can't be scribed at all, because neither creator knows the arcane version of Cure Light Wounds.

That's not required.

The class of the creator of the scroll determines whether it's arcane or divine. The creator of the scroll is a wizard; the scroll is divine.

The paladin is not the creator of the scroll. However, prerequisite spells in item creation can be supplied by a second party or by an item. Therefore the paladin can supply the spell Cure Light Wounds, allowing the creator - the wizard - to scribe it onto the scroll.

It just happens that neither of them can use it.

He's not scribing "Arcane Cure Light Wounds"; he's scribing "Cure Light Wounds" onto an arcane scroll.

-Hyp.

 

[Starglim]

That's not required.

The class of the creator of the scroll determines whether it's arcane or divine. The creator of the scroll is a wizard; the scroll is divine.

The paladin is not the creator of the scroll. However, prerequisite spells in item creation can be supplied by a second party or by an item. Therefore the paladin can supply the spell Cure Light Wounds, allowing the creator - the wizard - to scribe it onto the scroll.

It just happens that neither of them can use it.

Hm. That's clearer. But in that case, I don't agree that the prerequisite for an arcane scroll of Cure Light Wounds has been met. edit: removed bad example

 

[Lord Pendragon]

It's not right to allow these two casters to create an item that, for example, a bard could use to learn Cure Light Wounds.

*blink*

A bard can already learn Cure Light Wounds, and he doesn't need a scroll to do it.

Incidentally, the reason I asked the questions about cooperative scribing is because I have a paladin, and I was hoping to be able to ask the party wizard to craft me a few scrolls of paladin spells, but it seems that's not possible.

On a related not, the price for a scroll of Bless Weapon in the SRD is listed as 100gp. This would appear incorrect if a paladin with Scribe Scroll crafted it, since (AFAIK) it would be spell level x caster level x 25gp for the market price. So 1 x 2 x 25 should be 50gp, not 100gp. Unless the SRD is (erroneously?) using the paladin's character level, instead of his caster level?