Cost of Core Books PDFs

[Scribble]

So a PDF is MUCH cheaper to produce then a printed book. IF the difference in cost wasn't substantial a lot more of these PDF publishers would be offering their books, in print, at Amazon and on store shelves, rather than maybe as print on demand at Lulu's.

If all I was getting in a pdf was a scanned copy of the book, that consisted of mostly pictures that I could scroll through and read, then yes, I would probably be on your side.

However, as I've explained before, PDFs offer me a number of advantages that I find a lot of value in, and am willing to pay for.

1. Ability to cut and paste. (I do a lot of my game prep work on my computer. Both because I find it's faster, and because my handwriting is horrible, so if I want to actually be able to READ my adventure notes... then computer it is.) Also cut and paste makes it easy for me to put together "favorites" like all my favorite feats from various books, or all the various classes we'll be using in the upcoming campaign...

2. Ability to search quickly. (I find searching for things easier then the index. Especially because sometimes what I'm searching for isn't always something they would think to include in an index.)

3. Transportable- I do a lot (pretty much all) of my game prep durring free time at work. I don't want to deal with brining all my books to work everyday. The ability to put them in my pocket is worth money to me.

4. Space. I don't have a ton of space in my apartment that I can dedicate to my hobby. My fiance is also a non-gamer. So anytime I add a new book to the collection, it tends to bring up the "do you really NEED all of these books for that game?" question... pdfs allow me to avoid that.

So yes, the pdf versions don't have the costs of transportation and shelf space and such. But for someone like me, the added value of the above is worth money to me.

I can see how it might not be to someone who doesn't want or need the functions might not consider them valuble, but to say that they are worthless to anyone is a bit of a stretch.

 

[El Mahdi]

You did not pay full retail price for the printed books. The PDFs cost less than full retail price. Your discounted purchase does not invalidate this fact.

The fact is, no one in the US actually paid $34.95 for each book unless they just didn't try to find any of the deals readily available. Even most game stores sold it at a discount. I don't care about the retail price stamped on the book. What are people in the US actually "PAYING" for the books? Paying" $75 for a PDF bundle is more than what anyone in the US had to "Pay" for the hardcopies, and in most cases that included shipping.

 

[El Mahdi]

P.S. If all initial sales of the books are discounted to one extent or another, then that is essentially the defacto price of the books, not $34.95.

 

[El Mahdi]

I can see how it might not be to someone who doesn't want or need the functions might not consider them valuble, but to say that they are worthless to anyone is a bit of a stretch.

I'm not denying that these books are valuable to you. I'm definately not saying that the convenience and special functions of a PDF aren't very useful. But I don't think I'm going out on a limb by saying that those such as yourself who prefer the PDF as their main publication are in a very small minority. If this wasn't the case there should be an extremely larger amount of PDF's being sold.

 

[amethal]

Well, wait a minute.

In this thread, the last thing said by the Rouse

"I am quite sure this has been said before in other posts/threads. If you just want to buy the PDF that will be available for full MSRP. I am not sure how many will take advantage of this as the book/e-book is such a better value."

?

When did it go from "We'll be selling through third parties and it the book/e-book deal is dead."

Where's the "such a better value"?

If I consider the PDF to have value, I could just get another set of hardcovers at Amazon cheaper and scan 'em myself and while the labor costs are higher, I don't have to have a "persaonlized" version or give another person/entity credit card information, etc...

Hopefully the book / ebook deal isn't dead, just delayed.

Otherwise, 3catcircus might have been right when he raised the possibility that WotC as a company* was lying.

EDIT - from reading the other DF thread, it appears the Rules Compendium thing that is part of DDI is now replacing the book / ebook thing.


* not necessarily any individual employees, who are presumably acting in good faith based on what they themselves had been told.

 

[JoeGKushner]

In terms of "seriousness", did WoTC ever bother to update their older books with the errata? Like Complete Divine so that when looking at Tharzidian it didn't see "See ToEE" for example?

Lots of talk about errata and with the ability to do so with PDF... the LACK of that speaks to me more than the price.

If WoTC said clearly, "When we get the errata, no more than 30 days out from it being in the stores, we will update the PDFs and any further errata updates, will also be updated. We do not expect our customers to tolerate old methodologies we used in places like the Spell Compendium for example."

Cause a PDF of the Player's Handbook or Monster Manual that was actually up to date and errata free? Like the old credit card commercial... "Priceless." I could then print the corrected pages and just put 'em in the book as opposed to highlighting, marking, etc... my book.

 

[Mercule]

I wonder if it might be feasible to tie pdf discounts to a DDI account. Say, if you sign up for one year in advance, you can buy pdfs at $10 each.

Well, that'd cinch both the DDI and the PDF sale for me. DDI was a cinch, but between the potential vaporware aspect and the fact that I see my current 3.5 campaign continuing through the year, not so much.

 

[racoffin]

The fact is, no one in the US actually paid $34.95 for each book unless they just didn't try to find any of the deals readily available. Even most game stores sold it at a discount. I don't care about the retail price stamped on the book. What are people in the US actually "PAYING" for the books? Paying" $75 for a PDF bundle is more than what anyone in the US had to "Pay" for the hardcopies, and in most cases that included shipping.

Do you have any math or statistics to back this up? Not every game store, book store, or whatever store discounted. And not every shopper pours over the internet looking for the absolute lowest price. If I recall correctly, there were a number of people in several other threads unhappy with the price they got on their books.

The PDFs are overpriced for you. For others, the benefits seem to outweigh any concern about that price.

 

[Scribble]

I'm not denying that these books are valuable to you. I'm definately not saying that the convenience and special functions of a PDF aren't very useful.

That's my point. They have a use, and when something has a use it also has a value. If it didn't have the uses I listed, then it would not have a value, and I would agree that the PDFs would need to be much cheaper.

But I don't think I'm going out on a limb by saying that those such as yourself who prefer the PDF as their main publication are in a very small minority.

Actually I preffer them mainly for things I will use as a DM. For things I need all the time at the table, I tend to prefer print books. As far as being in the minority... What's that have to do with anything? I'm talking about PDFs selling value. That value isn't as popular to people, but it still exisists.

If this wasn't the case there should be an extremely larger amount of PDF's being sold.

I don't know the actual figures. My guess is once the perfect digital paper, the pdf market will boom. (when that happens is anyone's guess though.)

 

[ki11erDM]

THE DEVELOPMENT HAS ALREADY BEEN DONE.

That made me laugh the most out of all the other hilarious comments on this thread.

Development is done on the hard bound books as well… so shouldn’t the 2nd printing be cheaper? I am sure WoTC does not have ANY ongoing costs nor would they be using the profits from the Core books to pay for the next set of books or anything. LOL

Some of you really need to take some basic economics and business classes before you get torque off about a business spreading production costs over an entire product line. Not to mention the whole concept of a free economy, if you don’t like the price don’t pay it… if enough people don’t pay it they will have to reduce the price. But then this is the intertubes, I guess we don’t have to worry about reality here.