D&D 5E Could the next book be Advanced D&D?

JohnnyNitro

First Post
Had a thought: what are the odds our next "core" book is AD&D? Introduce a bunch of "optional" variants such as Race/Class prereq's, expanded Spell List and Equipment, fully fleshed-out Grid rules, Kits, Psionics, etc. It seems like the natural progression of 5th-as-cousin-of-2nd Ed...
 

log in or register to remove this ad

Well there hasn't been an AD&D since 2nd edition. 3E was just D&D as was 4E and now 5E. If WOTC did release such a book, then someone could once again proclaim that they won Dungeons & Dragons-and it was ADVANCED! :lol:
 

Patrick McGill

First Post
I think a set of such options would be what I want the most, but I also think that a set of such options would be counter to what their release plans are. That is, every release tied into the meta-story, and that being based in Forgotten Realms.
 

In a word, no. Well be lucky if we get a book like SCAG with a smattering of crunch. WotC seem keen on keeping the crunch bloat down. As a DM I think it's great, as someone who really enjoys reading crunch and theory crafting, it's a bit sad. They'll leave the bloat to pathfinder and DM Guild products imo
 

5Shilling

Explorer
Unlikely. On the other hand, around when 5E launched there was talk of optional rule "modules" that would alter or expand the game in a very specific direction for each, with game tables able to mix and match depending on the flavour of campaign they wanted. That's not really happened so far, other than a few options in the DMG. I'd still like to see that happen though.
 

spectacle

First Post
I think a set of such options would be what I want the most, but I also think that a set of such options would be counter to what their release plans are. That is, every release tied into the meta-story, and that being based in Forgotten Realms.
WotC has stated that they are working on the "first major mechanical expansion" to 5E, so it looks like a break with the regular release cycle. I doubt it will be called "advanced" though, the name AD&D has too much baggage. 5E is arguably more "advanced" than 2E AD&D already, at least if you cound "advancement" by the amount of rules in the PHB.
 

CapnZapp

Legend
If there's one thing I feel WotC will avoid, it's splitting their customer base.

Giving off the impression there's two games (D&D and AD&D) is the last thing they'd do.

So far, all crunch have pretty clearly been optional. I think they want to keep it that way, and so I don't think they will want to release a huge chunk of crunch in one go, especially if the "internet wisdom" says it's a "must have" content, so that the player base splits into the haves and the havenots.

The obvious candidate for a rules expansion is psionics. By its very nature it's not "must have". It won't add powercreepy options for the existing classes.
 

WotC has stated that they are working on the "first major mechanical expansion" to 5E, so it looks like a break with the regular release cycle. I doubt it will be called "advanced" though, the name AD&D has too much baggage. 5E is arguably more "advanced" than 2E AD&D already, at least if you cound "advancement" by the amount of rules in the PHB.

AD&D is more "advanced" in terms of trying to construct a complete world. Monsters had ecologies, favored terrains, and social organizations instead of just combat stats, for example; there were rules for spell research; there were rules for sprinting faster than a jog; there were rules for diplomacy and negotiaon (reaction rolls); and a number of other advanced scenarios and rules which aren't strictly necessary to run a simple dungeon crawl.

5E often feels like a shallow copy of AD&D. There are enough similarities to be recognizable, but there aren't as many game structures because 5E relies a lot of DM handwaving. That's not necessarily a big deal because I can always just create my own rules, but I don't buy the idea that 5E is at all "advanced" in terms of game mechanics. It might be bloated with content, but it's not mechanically deep.

It sure would be interesting to have a WotC-supported game structure for something other than dungeon crawling. For example, politicking. You can create your own game structure[1] whereby the players "win" some scenarios by undermining or embarrassing a given enemy whom they're not allowed to simply murder (for legal reasons or otherwise), but you're on your own if you do so, and your subsystem is unlikely to interact well with content created by anyone else. If on the other hand WotC had some published rules module about the effects of "reputation points" and the gaining or undermining thereof, you'd be more likely to see backgrounds/magic items/spells/adventures that interact somehow with the PCs' reputation points, and maybe the Internet metagame would start optimizing for something other than DPR.

[1] Here's a really, really quick version: reputation exists within a certain context which we'll call a peer group. Everyone in the peer group knows the reputation of everyone else in the Peer Group. A minor embarrassment (by the standards of that peer group) such as not getting invited to a party costs you 5 reputation (within that peer group), while a minor victory (getting a famous celebrity to attend) earns you 5 reputation. A major embarrassment (clothes catching on fire at a party) could cost up to half your reputation, while a major victory (saving the city) could double it. (DM's discretion here as to magnitude.) The only mechanical effects of reputation are that you can give it away to someone with less reputation, you can spend it to "attack" the reputation of someone who has less than you do (degrading both equally on a 1:1 basis), and everyone knows how much reputation everyone has. The additional roleplaying consequence is that people who want reputation within a certain peer group are likely to cooperate with those with high reputation, who therefore have the power to enhance or destroy other people's reputations. Toadies and flunkies, in-groups, out-groups, etc., all emerge naturally from this simple set of rules.

You can participate in multiple peer groups and have different reputations within each. I might have loads of street cred (Reputation: 500 among the Waterdeep Toughs) but be virtually unknown amongst the nobility (Reputation: 5 for once attending a certain party) and yet be hated and feared by chromatic dragons (Reputation: 200 for killing three dragons). Note that Reputation doesn't have to mean that people like you (the dragons hate me), but if I want to spend my credibility mocking a certain chromatic dragon he has to respond (likely by trying to kill me) or be shamed among his peers. A regular peasant wouldn't have that kind of leverage.
 

CapnZapp

Legend
If there's one kind of book I hope they don't release, it's an Adventurer's Equipment Guide.

Without fail each and every such attempt I have bought, used or merely seen; have been full of suck. And crap. And crappy suck.

What I never have had any need for is yet another internally inconsistent and unreal price list for goods my players will never buy. What the game cannot handle is yet another batch of mercurial greatswords and other items made out of unobtainium that are simply better than the PHB (and often DMG) stuff.

If we're lucky, that is. When we're not (and it is not a matter of if) the players will quickly scan the item lists and cherrypick the dozen or so items that are truly broken. The very idea to release a book directly to the players that the DM "doesn't need" to vet beforehand is really what's broken.

So that's one book I hope is way back in the queue.
 

JohnnyNitro

First Post
Really for me, all of this was borne of something I think Mearls or Crawford (maybe Perkins) said a while back about the PHB being filled with "hints" as to material in the works, i.e. the Ravenloft example in the Intro Chapter and the now-obvious reference to the Battlerager in the Barbarian Intro. Trying to extrapolate what other clues may be hidden in there...
 

Remove ads

Top