could use some help pricing an item

[Greenfield]

Our group just acquired a magic item in play.

It's a Colossal Ranseur that can project 8D6 fireballs every d? number of rounds.

The weapon has no magical plusses, and is far too large for anyone in the group to wield. Hell, it's a tree trunk with a magical metal head bigger than my game table.

Obviously we can't keep or use it, but it clearly has value: Consider it as a magical siege weapon, or mounted castle defense, or as a ship's weapon.

It's specifically the head that's magical, so the "tree trunk" part can be cut down to size so it can be mounted.

But I have no idea how to price such a thing.

Any suggestions? (And, as in school, please show your work.)

 

[BlackSeed_Vash]

Technically, cutting it down is considered breaking it, thus preventing the magic from working... but rule zero can easily take care of that. Also, I'm trying not to laugh at the mental image of a pea sized bead shooting out of the tip of a colossal sized weapon.

OT: Could you clarify "d? number of rounds". Without and exact indication on how often it can be used, pricing will be difficult. With that out of the way, lets take a look at a few items that can cast fireball.

(1) Necklace of Fireball - In the text, it states you can purchase individual, single use spheres for 150 per 1d6, putting your 8d6 at 1,200gp per casting.
(2) Staff of Fire - While its highly unlikely that an 8th level player would get their hands on one, lets alone only use it to cast fireball, if they did use it just like a wand, they'd be spending 355g per casting.
(3) Wand of Fireball - Keeping with the 8d6, we'll make set it to 8th level caster, so we have 375*3*8 = 9,000gp. If you look at the price per charge, you're paying 180g per casting.
(4) Scroll of Fireball - Using an 8th caster level (12.5*3*8) we get a 300gp price per casting.
(5) Blast Globes from the MIC provide a 400ft range 10d6 fireball once per day for 8,000gp. Nowhere near exact, but if lets fudge some number. Dividing by the caster level 10 and then multiplying by caster level 8 we get (8000/10)*8 = 6,4000gp. Honestly that feel rather cheep... especially compared to the custom magic item rules (3*8*1800 = 43,200gp).

Taking all of these examples into consideration:
[A] If the "siege" weapon has a limited number of casting and is non-rechargeable, I'd set the value at 2000gp + (300gp per charges remaining). This version should have at most 50 charges.
If it has a limited number of casting and is rechargeable, I'd set the value at 2000pg + (1,200gp per charges remaining). This version should have at most 10 charges.
[C] If it has a once per day use, I'd charge 8,400gp.
[D] If it has between 2 and 5 uses per day, I'd charge 2000gp + (3,20gp per use).
[E] If it has unlimited uses per day (even with a cool down in the hours range), the PCs should not sell it. It would be in their best interest to invest in Knowledge engineering (their own or paying for a NPC's services) to construct a siege platform to house and utilize this weapon. Of course this would completely change the nature of the game you guys are playing. If I had to put a price on this, I wouldn't go any less than 43,200g

If you're wondering where the extra 2,000gp is coming from, I figured that was a decent price for the PCs to tack on for safely cutting the weapon down and hauling it to whomever ends up buying this monstrosity.

 

[Nagol]

I'd create it as a command-word spell effect with a cost reduction for the recharge hindrance.

From the “Estimating Magic Item Gold Piece Values” table, that makes the base cost

So 1,800 * 3 * 8 = 43,200 gp

Since the item can't be used every round at-will, I'd give it a cost reduction that depends on the average recharge time. The estimation guide suggests a “daily limit” should reduce the cost approximately 60%.

I'd set the hindrance factor to 2 / (the average recharge time). For example if the average recharge time is 3 rounds, the item would only have 2/3 the base price. If the recharge time average is 10 rounds, the price would drop to 20% of its base price. Thus if the item can be used every other round, there is no reduction in value.


That drops the effective price for the 3-round example to 43.200 / 3 = 28,800 gp.

 

[Greenfield]

I seem to recall that "unlimited uses" wondrous items have a cost multiplier that may come into play (though I can't seem to find it in my PDF of the DMG). I'd apply that and then come up with a discount for the delay.

Okay, found it.

DMG Page 285, Table 7-33

If an item is continuous or unlimited uses, not charged, determine cost as if it had 100 charges. If it has a daily limit, determine it as if it had 50 charges.

Charges per day says to divide by (five divided by charges per day). So price / (5 / 100 ). Translation, price times 20, because dividing by 1/20th is the same as multiplying by 20. (As opposed to dividing into 20ths.)

So let's run some numbers... Spell level 3 times caster level 8 = 24, times 1800 = 43,200, times 20 is 864,000. Divide by 3.5 (average delay on a D6) and get 246,857 and some change.

Seems like way too much. Or not.

Too much to hand out as a PC treasure item. Too much for any town, most cities and pretty much all ship captains to afford.

As a hard-to-break siege or defense weapon though... One such well placed weapon could decimate an army, or clear a quarter mile of city walls of defenders.

So after much work, we get an unworkable answer, if we go straight by the book.

 

[Grogg of the North]

Is the goal to give the players a large pile of cash? Or can they "sell" the item to a local kingdom in exchange for favors, prestige, etc?

 

[Greenfield]

I don't know, I'm not the DM who gave it out.

The game group meets at my house, and by convention the various DMs advise me after the game regarding what we faced, CR wise, and what loot we got.

I calculate the EXP for the PCS, based on their levels, and I email that out to the group.

That email typically includes the treasure list for the adventure, with both the list and resale prices for each item. I total them up, divide by the number of PCs involved, and tell everyone their share, in gold.

We always presume that everything will be sold. If a PC wants to buy an item from the list, they can. They pay the resale price. They can pay from their share, or add gold from whatever cash reserve they might have. Sometimes someone will add an item instead, and they get credit equal to the item's resale value.

Last week we faced a pack of CR 5 monsters, and a CR 7. Since we're levels 9, 10 and 11, it was pretty much a forgone conclusion, but they put up a good fight.

Their big guy was a Huge skeletal Giant (Cloud, I think) wielding a Colossal Ranseur that fired 8D6 fireballs every D6 or so rounds.

Now the shaft is as long as my driveway, and the head is probably the size of a small car's hood, so there's absolutely nobody who can wield the thing. I doubt that there's anyone who can lift the thing, and being magical we can't use Shrink Item on it. But the magic's specifically in the head, so we can cut off the master worked log it's using as a haft and sling the head on a pack horse.

And, knowing this group, (I'm in it), we'll try.

BTW: After discussing this with the DM a bit, I'm going to omit it from the treasure list for now. We aren't anywhere we actually could sell it, nor are we likely to be any time soon. We have time to figure it out.

 

[Grogg of the North]

I'm thinking that lugging around such an item is going to fall into "Awesome but Impractical". Probably the easiest solution is to "gift" this to one of your player's home towns. Hopefully, in exchange you can gain access to libraries, mage towers, guild armories and have some influence in the region.

Now, what I would do is find a way to drag that thing back to town. Get yourself a cart. Build a wooden roof on the cart. Ironwood; ironwood, everywhere! From inside your vehicle, have a way to aim your fireball spear head. Add in more ways to attack. Slits for crossbows, spears, whatever. Throw on something like Animate Objects so you can have the cart move. Maybe everyone takes EWP (hand crossbow) and learns to fire them sideways?

 

[Greenfield]

The party is in the middle of an area similar to the northern Canadian plains. No towns for days.

We used Mount to call up a pack animal, and we tied the thing to the back.

We'll probably end up either being forced to abandon it, or we'll end up giving it to the High King.

It's really up to the DM whether we'll be able to get it anywhere, or what if any reward we'll get for it.

It's a big thing in may ways, but shouldn't dominate the game.

 

[Greenfield]

As a general update: The DM decided to price it like a Staff of Fire.

There was never a question of some PC using this. It's too large to wield, even under an Enlarge Person.

In essence, this is what someone will pay us to get it out of the game.