Messageboard Golem
First Post
200 counters with a fiendish theme
Counter Pack 1
omedon
First Post
Counter Pack 1: Demons & Devils
This product has been out a good long while now has yet to receive a review and since I was lucky enough to find a copy in a Vancouver game store in January, for half price no less, I thought it was time that I share my thoughts on it.
Counter Pack 1: Demons & Devils signals a number of firsts for Fiery Dragon Productions (FDP).
Counter Pack 1 (CP1) consists of over 65 distinct counter illustrations spanning 8 sheets with 220 Demons & Devils ranging from CR 1 to 20; 122 of which come from the Monster Manual, 48 from Armies of the Abyss, and 50 from Legions of Hell.
The price works out to 5 cents per counter; slightly more than the 3.5 cents per counter of CC2 and roughly a 100 times cheaper than a metal miniature.
The pack also comes with a 4-page booklet that explains how to use the counters and presents some new d20 material in the form of a 3 Base Demons and a Demonic Additions Table that consists of 6 templates that are as follows:
Stretching Demon, Lightning Breed, Night Breed, Fire Breed, Raging Demon, and Death Demon
You can add these templates to any existing demon to create an alternate, beefed up version. Or you can apply them to any of the three base demon statistics provided to create an entirely new creature. The three base demons are a Minor, Intermediate, and Major Demon.
The Good
A number of improvements have been made over CC2. A counter index is now printed on each sheet so it is easier to figure out which counters represent which monsters if you are unfamiliar with what they look like. And some of the more abundant creatures in the pack such as the Kyton, Lemure, Dretch, and Vrock come in two different renditions adding some variety.
If you are familiar with Claudio Pozas work then you know what you can expect art wise. The counters have a kind of comic book style with dark lines and superb colouring. I was very happy with Claudio's work on CC2 and the counters here are on par with that collection if not slightly better. My personal favourite is the massive soul keeper, which has outstanding colour and texturing. My other favourites include the Bulugon and the Barbed Devil.
The Demonic Additions Templates are another great addition as they are both appropriate to the theme and relevant to the purchaser. I am sure that anyone who finds they frequently use these counters in their campaign will appreciate the extra variety that the templates add to their game. It is always fun to throw a curve ball at unsuspecting players. I am sure that the Stretching Demon and Raging Demon templates will find their way into one of my campaigns somewhere down the line.
The Bad
Their isn't much not to like about this Counter Pack except a few minor nit picks. My first complaint is that the Green Ronin counter sheets feature a picture of the respective source book in the top left corner next to the counter index. I feel that this was unnecessary; FDP could have simply labelled the sheets as Armies of the Abyss and Legions of Hell instead of printing the books cover. This would have made room for 16 more 1x1 counters.
My second minor complaint is that unlike CC2 the counters in this pack aren't perforated so you will have to do some cutting. I don't mind cutting out the counters myself, unless they are those blasted round ones that come with Dungeon Magazine, but I thought I should mention it for people who have bought CC1 or 2 so they will know what to expect in this more recent incarnation as it is a slight step backwards.
Conclusion
I have made good use of my FDP counters. They are a great alternative to miniatures. I play in a campaign at the local university and bring all my counters to every game I attend. With CC1, CC2, and CP1 that is over 1000 counters. Even if I could afford to buy that many miniatures there is no way I could fit them all into a 6x8x3 inch Tupperware container and bring them with me. They are aesthetically pleasing, functional, portable, and affordable.
I feel that CP1 features several marked improvements over CC2. The number of counters per creature is appropriate for their challenge rating; no creature is short changed. The D20 rules material is relevant to the product and not simply tacked on. And although the cost per counter has slightly increased, moving to a pack with a tighter theme ensures that you are only paying for counters you expect to make good use of. If you do not use a lot of demons and devils in your games you can easily skip this purchase but if you do you should definitely consider picking up Counter Pack 1: Demons & Devils. It delivers in spades.
Counter Pack Index
Demons
Monster Manual Armies of the Abyss
2 X Balor 4 X Alastor
2 X Bebilith 2 X Alrune
14 X Dretch 2 X Darba
2 X Glabiezu 6 X Demon Locust
14 X Heziou 3 X Incubus
4 X Maralith 2 X Jahi
2 X Nalfeshnee 4 X Mandragoras
8 X Quasit 2 X Paigoel
2 X Retriever 8 X Schir
4 X Succubus 7 X Shoggti
8 X Vrock 7 X Solesik
1 X Soulkeeper
Devils
Monster Manua Legions of Hell
6 X Barbazu 4 X Ashmede
3 X Cornugon 4 X Bulugon
2 X Erinyes 6 X Darksphinx
3 X Gelugon 3 X Distender
4 X Hamatula 5 X Gladiatrix
3 X Hellcat 4 X Ice Stalker
4 X Imp 5 X Keie
11 X Kyton 3 X Magugon
14 X Lemure 4 X Pain Mistress
4 X Osyluth 4 X Painshrieker
4 X Pit Fiend 8 X Whiptail
This product has been out a good long while now has yet to receive a review and since I was lucky enough to find a copy in a Vancouver game store in January, for half price no less, I thought it was time that I share my thoughts on it.
Counter Pack 1: Demons & Devils signals a number of firsts for Fiery Dragon Productions (FDP).
- It is the first FDP product to be released since they left the Sword & Sorcery banner
- It is their first counter product to come in a smaller; more focused pack format rather than the larger more encompassing collection format
- And it is the first to counter product to feature another d20 publisher, which in this case happens to be Green Ronin and the monsters from their excellent Armies of the Abyss and Legions of Hell source books.
Counter Pack 1 (CP1) consists of over 65 distinct counter illustrations spanning 8 sheets with 220 Demons & Devils ranging from CR 1 to 20; 122 of which come from the Monster Manual, 48 from Armies of the Abyss, and 50 from Legions of Hell.
The price works out to 5 cents per counter; slightly more than the 3.5 cents per counter of CC2 and roughly a 100 times cheaper than a metal miniature.
The pack also comes with a 4-page booklet that explains how to use the counters and presents some new d20 material in the form of a 3 Base Demons and a Demonic Additions Table that consists of 6 templates that are as follows:
Stretching Demon, Lightning Breed, Night Breed, Fire Breed, Raging Demon, and Death Demon
You can add these templates to any existing demon to create an alternate, beefed up version. Or you can apply them to any of the three base demon statistics provided to create an entirely new creature. The three base demons are a Minor, Intermediate, and Major Demon.
The Good
A number of improvements have been made over CC2. A counter index is now printed on each sheet so it is easier to figure out which counters represent which monsters if you are unfamiliar with what they look like. And some of the more abundant creatures in the pack such as the Kyton, Lemure, Dretch, and Vrock come in two different renditions adding some variety.
If you are familiar with Claudio Pozas work then you know what you can expect art wise. The counters have a kind of comic book style with dark lines and superb colouring. I was very happy with Claudio's work on CC2 and the counters here are on par with that collection if not slightly better. My personal favourite is the massive soul keeper, which has outstanding colour and texturing. My other favourites include the Bulugon and the Barbed Devil.
The Demonic Additions Templates are another great addition as they are both appropriate to the theme and relevant to the purchaser. I am sure that anyone who finds they frequently use these counters in their campaign will appreciate the extra variety that the templates add to their game. It is always fun to throw a curve ball at unsuspecting players. I am sure that the Stretching Demon and Raging Demon templates will find their way into one of my campaigns somewhere down the line.
The Bad
Their isn't much not to like about this Counter Pack except a few minor nit picks. My first complaint is that the Green Ronin counter sheets feature a picture of the respective source book in the top left corner next to the counter index. I feel that this was unnecessary; FDP could have simply labelled the sheets as Armies of the Abyss and Legions of Hell instead of printing the books cover. This would have made room for 16 more 1x1 counters.
My second minor complaint is that unlike CC2 the counters in this pack aren't perforated so you will have to do some cutting. I don't mind cutting out the counters myself, unless they are those blasted round ones that come with Dungeon Magazine, but I thought I should mention it for people who have bought CC1 or 2 so they will know what to expect in this more recent incarnation as it is a slight step backwards.
Conclusion
I have made good use of my FDP counters. They are a great alternative to miniatures. I play in a campaign at the local university and bring all my counters to every game I attend. With CC1, CC2, and CP1 that is over 1000 counters. Even if I could afford to buy that many miniatures there is no way I could fit them all into a 6x8x3 inch Tupperware container and bring them with me. They are aesthetically pleasing, functional, portable, and affordable.
I feel that CP1 features several marked improvements over CC2. The number of counters per creature is appropriate for their challenge rating; no creature is short changed. The D20 rules material is relevant to the product and not simply tacked on. And although the cost per counter has slightly increased, moving to a pack with a tighter theme ensures that you are only paying for counters you expect to make good use of. If you do not use a lot of demons and devils in your games you can easily skip this purchase but if you do you should definitely consider picking up Counter Pack 1: Demons & Devils. It delivers in spades.
Counter Pack Index
Demons
Monster Manual Armies of the Abyss
2 X Balor 4 X Alastor
2 X Bebilith 2 X Alrune
14 X Dretch 2 X Darba
2 X Glabiezu 6 X Demon Locust
14 X Heziou 3 X Incubus
4 X Maralith 2 X Jahi
2 X Nalfeshnee 4 X Mandragoras
8 X Quasit 2 X Paigoel
2 X Retriever 8 X Schir
4 X Succubus 7 X Shoggti
8 X Vrock 7 X Solesik
1 X Soulkeeper
Devils
Monster Manua Legions of Hell
6 X Barbazu 4 X Ashmede
3 X Cornugon 4 X Bulugon
2 X Erinyes 6 X Darksphinx
3 X Gelugon 3 X Distender
4 X Hamatula 5 X Gladiatrix
3 X Hellcat 4 X Ice Stalker
4 X Imp 5 X Keie
11 X Kyton 3 X Magugon
14 X Lemure 4 X Pain Mistress
4 X Osyluth 4 X Painshrieker
4 X Pit Fiend 8 X Whiptail
Sorry about the blank comment above:
The first counter packs were sized with 3.0 base rather than 3.5. Several counters were not quite correct, including things like large-long (displacer beast, horse, ankheg, dragons). Are these fixed?
I felt that the original counter packs were certainly worth a 5, but this became downgraded to 4 when WOTC decided to change monster facing.
The first counter packs were sized with 3.0 base rather than 3.5. Several counters were not quite correct, including things like large-long (displacer beast, horse, ankheg, dragons). Are these fixed?
I felt that the original counter packs were certainly worth a 5, but this became downgraded to 4 when WOTC decided to change monster facing.
omedon
First Post
Counter Pack 1 came out a year before 3.5e did so the counters conform to the 3.0 standard. It is a 3.0 product and should be rated as such.
The good news is that almost all the counters have square facing already so they should work equally well whether you prefer to use the 3.0 or 3.5 facing rules. The hellcats and demon locusts are the only rectangular counters in the pack. That is 9 out of 218 that don't conform to 3.5e.
Thanks for pointing that out though, it is something that people may want to take into consideration.
If you are looking for 3.5 compatible counters you may want to check out Counter Collection 5: Summoned Creatures and Counter Collection Gold.
The good news is that almost all the counters have square facing already so they should work equally well whether you prefer to use the 3.0 or 3.5 facing rules. The hellcats and demon locusts are the only rectangular counters in the pack. That is 9 out of 218 that don't conform to 3.5e.
Thanks for pointing that out though, it is something that people may want to take into consideration.
If you are looking for 3.5 compatible counters you may want to check out Counter Collection 5: Summoned Creatures and Counter Collection Gold.
