D&D 5E Crazy idea for Death Saves

[The Grassy Gnoll]

Ok, inspired by a few recent threads where this has come up, I had an idea for Death Saves and what they actually represent.

Some ENSiders have expressed a dislike for the unconscious --> ping! Awake nature of death saves, and there has been some discussion about alternatives - they're not KO'd, but bleeding out, incapacitated, winded, etc etc. Out of that comes the question, "what can you do if you're not unconscious, can you Interact with an Object", etc.

Another thread threw up the idea of making sure monsters and NPCs get Death Saves, not just the PCs.

So; my idea. Let me know what you think.

A lot depends on your first Death Save. If a Fail, you're out for the count, and if you then get your three saves, you come to.

If the first roll is a Pass, you are conscious but in a world of pain, dazed, double vision, etc. you can't do any Action other than Move or Help or some (very limited) Interact With An Object.

HELP
The Help can only be used if an enemy is within your normal reach.
This represents a scrabble at their legs to distract them while your buddy attacks.
An obvious drawback is that the enemy may well decide to hit you and finish you off.

MOVE
You can crawl away at a rate of 5' per turn.
This won't incur the normal Opportunity Attack as you are deemed to be no real threat.

INTERACT WITH AN OBJECT
Limited to simple tasks such as "Ring the bell", "Hunt for an object in your pack", "Scrawl the name of your enemy in your blood".
A person could in theory "drink a potion" but it would need to be broken down per round into "find potion in rucksack", followed the next round by "open potion and get in position to drink it". Then "drink potion" on round 3.
Similarly, any other normally easy Interaction would need to be broken down into three (or fewer, depending) very painful stages ( eg "open the door" = sit upright then operate handle for 2 stages).

ALL OF THE ABOVE COME AT A COST
Disadvantage on your Death Save for the next round.
Any Actions are taken after your Death Save (so you could bleed out before you ring the alarm bell).

THESE RULES APPLY TO MONSTERS AND NPCs TOO
Some of them, such as Help, maybe only realistically used by Monsters. PCs may find it too risky.

NATURAL 20s
Count as per usual. Automatic Back in the Room.

Bear in mind, there will only ever be a maximum of 5 death saves rolled before you recover or die, and this will only apply AT ALL in 50% of cases (first rolls of 10-19).

 

[MostlyDm]

Yeah, I like it. I usually don't play 0 HP as unconscious, and haven't in any edition; it breaks verisimilitude for me. Stunned and unable to act is usually the farthest I go.

 

[thalmin]

At first read, I like the concept. I'll need to work this through a bit and may change a few particulars, but overall I like. Yoink

 

[Rune]

Seems a bit crunchier than I would use. How about something simple:

If you are reduced to 0 hit points, you drop prone and have your speed reduced to 5 ft. Choosing to take any action (of any sort) or stand up gives you disadvantage on your next death save.

This is would mean that a character could crawl up to 5 feet without penalty, or stand up and walk up to 7.5 feet with a dash action, or perform a whole set of actions from prone--the latter two options both pushing the character closer to death. In all cases, one item interaction would fit in for free.

And, just for fun, I'd allow a special "death monologue" action that granted inspiration to an ally at the cost of three instant death save failures.

 

[redrick]

This feels like a great house rule. A little complicated to explain, but if you have a regular group that can get the hang of what can and can't be done, it could add some fun to being at 0 hp without buffing "unconscious" PCs more than they already are. It would be interesting to see, in play, how much players are willing to risk that disadvantage on death saves in order to take these actions. (Not to mention possibly drawing more attention from other combatants, which is pretty much game over for dying character.)

 

[Psikerlord#]

I fear this would lead to more dead characters, either by failing death saves with disad or drawing monster attention when already at zero...

I think the best way to avoid whack-a-mole is either tracking -ve HP, or using injuries at zero hp (make injury/death save at zero, if fail, roll on injury table, if success, no injury).

 

[The Grassy Gnoll]

[MENTION=6777696]redrick[/MENTION] - what prompted this really was the idea that that the death save rules would apply to monsters, too, as a way to make encounters that bit more challenging and/or tactical: thus, it's more from the DM side of the screen, but has some applications for the players, too.
[MENTION=67]Rune[/MENTION] - not sure about the one item interaction for free - they are at 0 or fewer HP, after all, so I feel there should...be...a...certain...amount of...effort...required.
Perhaps you could rule one item interaction or one move/help without breaking the interaction up into chunks if you preferred (I chose to 'chunk' to avoid the blasé "oh I just chug a healing potion" shrug off. I'd certainly rule that no spells could be cast - even verbal only ones, as there should still be a certain amount of focus and channeling that goes into your Healing Word, and I'd say being at 0 or below would be enough pain and disorientation to stop you from being able to do that.

Thanks all for feedback so far.

 

[redrick]

[MENTION=6777696]redrick[/MENTION] - what prompted this really was the idea that that the death save rules would apply to monsters, too, as a way to make encounters that bit more challenging and/or tactical: thus, it's more from the DM side of the screen, but has some applications for the players, too.

[MENTION=67]Rune[/MENTION] - not sure about the one item interaction for free - they are at 0 or fewer HP, after all, so I feel there should...be...a...certain...amount of...effort...required.
Perhaps you could rule one item interaction or one move/help without breaking the interaction up into chunks if you preferred (I chose to 'chunk' to avoid the blasé "oh I just chug a healing potion" shrug off. I'd certainly rule that no spells could be cast - even verbal only ones, as there should still be a certain amount of focus and channeling that goes into your Healing Word, and I'd say being at 0 or below would be enough pain and disorientation to stop you from being able to do that.

Thanks all for feedback so far.

Awesome. Yeah, in the hands of the DM, this could make for some really great, gnarly combats against large groups of opponents. As the fighter action surges through a group of goblins, the creatures he cuts down are moaning and crawling away from combat, or scrabbling at his heals trying to trip him up. That could get pretty metal.

The only problem becomes the additional book-keeping to track those death saves and actions. Might be more than my crowded index card could handle.

One possible variant might be to get rid of the death saves for the NPCs, but just give them a "dying act". Once an NPC is reduced to 0 hp, and not insta-killed, it is prone and bleeding out. Unless a character gives it one last chop, it can take one final action (under restrictions described above) on its next turn. You could require it to make a single death save to gain that final action. I just wouldn't want to have to track death saves for a dozen humanoids. (Because that's what I'm thinking here — a field strewn with dying humanoids at the feet of our callous adventurers.)

 

[Valmarius]

Awesome. Yeah, in the hands of the DM, this could make for some really great, gnarly combats against large groups of opponents. As the fighter action surges through a group of goblins, the creatures he cuts down are moaning and crawling away from combat, or scrabbling at his heals trying to trip him up. That could get pretty metal.

The only problem becomes the additional book-keeping to track those death saves and actions. Might be more than my crowded index card could handle.

One possible variant might be to get rid of the death saves for the NPCs, but just give them a "dying act". Once an NPC is reduced to 0 hp, and not insta-killed, it is prone and bleeding out. Unless a character gives it one last chop, it can take one final action (under restrictions described above) on its next turn. You could require it to make a single death save to gain that final action. I just wouldn't want to have to track death saves for a dozen humanoids. (Because that's what I'm thinking here — a field strewn with dying humanoids at the feet of our callous adventurers.)

I really like this variant. A single death save at the start of the monsters next turn could let it make a single action.
It means that it's a decision for the PC to either spend time confirming their kill, or hope the beast stays down and move on to the next one.

 

[The Grassy Gnoll]

Once you're up to the kind of levels where they're taking on fields of 20 goblins the PC damage output is likely to Insta-kill a lot, so hopefully the book keeping should be relatively simple and focused on the bigger bad guys.
Especially if they learn to do the old Bruce Lee foot stomp on their foes at early levels against a group of 5 or 6 goblins, they'll grow up with that tactic.