Creatures-By-Poll: Fey #5 (recovery effort)

[BOZ]

brainstorming is fine, but i'm hoping it leads to a more solid agreement of what to do...

 

[James Heard]

I do brainstorming fine, but agreement? Not so good. I still think kung fu polar bear necromancer fey would be kick butt. That's ok though everyone here might lose out, but eventually....one day....my players will suffer for everyone's lack of agreement with me.

 

[BOZ]

fair enough, then - i'll go with the general consensus of the rest of the group, on the breath weapon's effects.

 

[BOZ]

anyone care to comment then?

 

[Shade]

anyone care to comment then?

On what again?

What is the "general consensus of the rest of the group, on the breath weapon's effects"?

 

[BOZ]

nothing, yet. i've seen about a dozen ideas, but no one seems to feel particularly strongly about what the breath weapon should *do*, other than look all prism-ly.

please, here, post exactly what you think the breath weapon(s) should do.

Its breath weapon would come out as a prismatic effect, which could look something like Aurora Borealis. It could do any of the effects that Conaill mentioned (fear, deathwatch, enervation, harm, ray of enfeeblement, waves of exhaustion, energy drain), or something else. We could make it a typical breath weapon, or like I suggested earlier it could mimic the cloud breath weapon of an iron golem. I think it was also suggested that the breath could cause a fascination or hypnosis effect. I could see the breath causing more than one effect simultaneously, or multiple possible effects caused one at a time, as chosen by the bear. Discuss!

we need to solidify just exactly what it is that the breath weapon does. a number of suggestions have been posted so far. what *exactly* does everyone think the breath weapon(s) should do? i'm fine with, for example, having more than one separate breath (the way that some dragon types have), or having more than one effect tacked on to the same breath.

There's a new spell in the PHBII called Prismatic Mist (Sor/Wiz3) that might be interesting to sit a base effect on and then add a more CR appropriate kicker onto. Plus it ties in with new books, and who doesn't like excuses to buy new books? Well, besides people who can't afford them...The attached effect would probably have to be evil as heck to make up for the low level of that one.

Or, alternately I like the idea that it blinds, dazes/shaken/whatever, and does Con damage too. Maybe a low DC 15 save for permanent blindness, makes you helpless no matter what, and causes Con drain to allude to the death thing. Or level drain, level drain would be outstanding and different too. Something to make sure that the wussiness of being a fey doesn't nerf the "big scary bear" thing. If it can attack players and make them helpless THEN engage in melee...

Or, it breathes a cone of anti-magic that sucks up spell-levels. I don't know how you'd rationalize that, but it sounds like something fey would do.

After that, and including earlier suggestions of mine, my stream o consciousness brainstorm stops.

plus, i'm sure other ideas have been posted throughout the thread. we need to narrow it down more, obviously.

 

[Shade]

From http://www.allthingsarctic.com/aurora/index.aspx:

"Auroral displays appear in many colors with pale green and pink the most common. However, different shades of red, yellow, green, blue, and violet have all been observed. Green results from energized oxygen atoms and pink from nitrogen molecules. The color variations are a product of the altitude of the storm, and the density and composition of the ions at that altitude. The folding effect results from the electric field induced on either side of the auroral curtain by the electrons."

As a starting point, I'd suggest it function similar to prismatic spells, with following effects:

Pale green = sickened for X rounds on failed save; otherwise nauseated for X rounds
Pink = as touch of idiocy
Red = rage (as the spell) for X rounds
Yellow = blinded for X rounds on failed save; otherwise dazzled for X rounds
Green = enfeebled (as ray of enfeeblement)
Blue = exhausted for X rounds on failed save; otherwise fatigued for X rounds
Violet = frightened for X rounds on failed save; otherwise shaken for X rounds

Alteranatively, it can have the lights act as rainbow pattern, but otherwise remain harmless.

 

[BOZ]

OK, now there's a possibility - sort of like a poor man's prismatic spray.

you could take the rainbow pattern on top of that as a separate effect, or it could use the "lesser prismatic spray" or rainbow pattern as two separate weapons the way a gold dragon has two separate breath weapons.

what does everyone think about that - yea, or nay? if nay, what is your proposal?

 

[demiurge1138]

I like lesser prismatic spray and rainbow pattern both. I can see giving it two breath weapons.

Demiurge out.

 

[Conaill]

Never liked Prismatic <anything>, personally. Too much having to look things up in a table.

I'm still voting for Fear + Deathwatch + some form of necromantic (but non-evil) damage (all three at the same time). I think that would make for a very flavorful combination - you could literally be scared to death due to the realization of your own mortality!

 

[Conaill]

Another issue to decide: what powers should the "old man" form have? Is this purely to ease communication with other humanoids (seems unlikely)? Does the fey have the same powers (and abilities, strength etc.) as in bear form? Or does the humanoid form have additional sorcerous powers, whereas the bear form has raw strength plus the breath weapon?

Either way, I feel the bear should be its *true* form, so we can legitimately claim it's size Huge. But it seems like the humanoid form should have some extra functionality...

 

[BOZ]

Good point about the humanoid form's powers. First thing's first though...

I'm still voting for Fear + Deathwatch + some form of necromantic (but non-evil) damage (all three at the same time).

Inflict Light Wounds good enough?

OK, that gives us two solid, different ideas that we can do for the breath weapon. Any others? Rather than debate them, I will set up another poll later today.

 

[James Heard]

It should be a bit larger than inflict light, since the creature's HD are so obscene, right? We're talking about a creature that's probably going to be CR 16-20 right? It's got two forms, one of them a Huge tank, 16+ HD, a breath weapon, and probably at least most of the sorts of things you'd expect to see on a Dire Bear. If it's doing negative energy damage-as-hit-points then we could easily just look up a nasty dragon's breath weapon dice and call it negative energy damage, save fort for half. I'm still thinking ability drain and/or level drain would be a good extra too.

 

[dhaga]

I like lesser prismatic spray and rainbow pattern both. I can see giving it two breath weapons.

I'm a fan of the prismatic breath weapon, as well. I like the options for the colors outlined in Shade's post -- bad effect, save for not quite as bad of an effect.

2 breath weapons sounds like a good idea to me. The ones outlined by Shade -- would those be the "lesser prismatic" effect? What would be the "rainbow pattern" effect? Is that something that has not yet been outlined here (or possibly references a spell I'm not familiar with)?

 

[BOZ]

rainbow pattern is a spell from the PHB.

 

[Conaill]

Inflict Light Wounds good enough?

I assume you're joking, right? For a 16-18HD creature?

I believe the lowest spells I had suggested originally were Ray of Exhaustion (Sor/Wiz3) and Enervation (Sor/Wiz 4). But something like a 6-7th level spell might be better balanced. Mass Inflict Moderate (cone-shaped) would fit. Or Waves of Exhaustion. Or even a cone-shaped Enervation instead of the usual Ray.


PS: When I mentioned Deathwatch earlier, I meant that anyone within the cone of the breath would receive the benefit of the Deathwatch spell. I.e. the targets of the breathweapon would for an instance literally see the mortality of everything around them. A harmless effect (beneficial, if anything), but I figured it fit nicely with the theme, and with the Fear effect...

 

[Conaill]

rainbow pattern is a spell from the PHB.

Hmm... Give the bear form a breath weapon, but the humanoid form can cast Rainbow Pattern? That way the bear can be the "big smash" combat monster, whereas the humanoid form is more of a trickster fairy...


[Edit: If we *do* decide to go with a "prismatic" effect for the breath weapon, I would suggest to go for the full-on Prismatic Spray instead, not the "poor man's version". It's a 7th level spell, which should be balanced for a CR15+ monster.]

 

[James Heard]

I say we make the old man form weak as all get out (except for the change in stats from Huge and the HD), but give 'em prismatic sphere and circle of death at will....and give him kung fu.

ok ok ok, so I'm still stuck on kung fu. Nasty touch-me-not effects though? That would be neat.

 

[dhaga]

rainbow pattern is a spell from the PHB.

Ha. Shows you how many magic users I've played in 3rd Ed.

For the creature:
I agree with Conaill: a full-on prismatic spray breath weapon would be good. I haven't looked at the spell in awhile; do saves negate the effects, or are there lesser effects, as in Shade's "poor man's version"?

I agree with James Heard: I think Prismatic Sphere or the like would be good for the old man form. Not sure about Circle of Death at will, though, and would still prefer no kung-fu

 

[Conaill]

circle of death at will....and give him kung fu.

Wait a minute... aren't those essentially the same thing?