D&D and Poker: Not So Different

[SWBaxter]

The number of hardcore players is increasing, but the number of casual players is slowly going down.

I have a friend who runs an import business who used to bring in tons of poker chips, poker tables, and other knick-knacks - I got my information from him.

It seems to me that chips, tables, and other knick-knacks are more likely to sell to hardcore players, the casual player is the one who goes to the local casino/cardroom/etc. every now and then. By all accounts the latter group is booming, the former could well be saturated as there's only so many chips or tables a given player can use. To extend the D&D analogy, the stuff your friend imports is the equivalent of DM-focused supplements in D&D, and there isn't an exact analogue to player-focused products. Well, except for online poker with products like PokerOffice and PokerTracker, but the online world is a whole different kettle of (ahem) fish with the recent legislation in the US.

IMHO, the real sign that the poker craze is over will be when casinos start to shrink their poker rooms, which in and of themselves are considerably less profitable than devoting the same floorspace to slot machines and house games. That hasn't happened yet because poker is still a good draw, pulling traffic into the casino that otherwise wouldn't be there.

 

[kenobi65]

Two big differences between D&D and poker:

1) No one has yet figured out how to play D&D for big cash prizes.

2) I know of several D&D players who routinely lie to people and say that they're going to a poker game, because (they feel) it's less embarrasing. I've yet to hear of anyone covering up their poker-playing by saying they're going to go play D&D with their buddies.

 

[talien]

2) I know of several D&D players who routinely lie to people and say that they're going to a poker game, because (they feel) it's less embarrasing. I've yet to hear of anyone covering up their poker-playing by saying they're going to go play D&D with their buddies.

So here we have it: What makes Poker more socially acceptable? Isn't it a bunch of (usually) guys sitting around a table for hours?

 

[llamatron2000]

....the poker players are usually better-groomed.

 

[SWBaxter]

So here we have it: What makes Poker more socially acceptable? Isn't it a bunch of (usually) guys sitting around a table for hours?

Well, I personally am more likely to tell somebody I don't know that I play D&D than I am to tell them that I play poker*. But in general, I think the fact that poker is (a) competitive and (b) had a long history of being a "real man's" pastime in movies/TV/etc. makes it pretty acceptable. Never underestimate social inertia.

* I'm not particularly embarassed by either hobby, but my D&D experience is often improved by meeting fellow gamers or bringing in interested newbies, so I don't mind advertising that I play. Whereas I don't play poker for the camaraderie, I just go to the local casino and play with a bunch of people I'll probably never see anywhere else.

 

[LostSoul]

So here we have it: What makes Poker more socially acceptable? Isn't it a bunch of (usually) guys sitting around a table for hours?

Money.

 

[kenobi65]

But in general, I think the fact that poker is (a) competitive and (b) had a long history of being a "real man's" pastime in movies/TV/etc. makes it pretty acceptable. Never underestimate social inertia.

Yup.

In every Western movie, what are the rough, tough cowboys sitting around the table in the saloon playing? Poker.

In "The Odd Couple", what did Oscar and his buddies play? Poker.

In "Mazes and Monsters", what did Tom Hanks and his fellow social outcasts sit around the table and play? D&D.

 

[Fat Daddy]

There are a lot of good points that have been brought up in this thread. I will go ahead and add my 2 cents.
The main difference is that IME D&D is always a social event. A group of friends and acquaintances gathering for fun and comeraderie. Poker CAN be that type of event but often is not. Many times it is a group of strangers trying to get over on each other. I like poker but only play in social groups or, if I go to a poker room, I always have a couple of buddies with me so it is a social event for us (even if it is not for the other players).
Given the choice, I'll take D&D everytime.

 

[ssampier]

It's a good question. To answer your question, I will ask another related question, "What makes fantasy football so socially accepted?" The game is pure stats. There is a social element of razing your buddies (calling him during the game), but in large, it's pure numbers. In my mind you can't get more geeky than that.

I am still surprised that poker makes a popular TV show. I imagine it's the same notion that keeps gameshows around; the chance to win millions of dollars for virtually nothing.

Yup.

In every Western movie, what are the rough, tough cowboys sitting around the table in the saloon playing? Poker.

In "The Odd Couple", what did Oscar and his buddies play? Poker.

In "Mazes and Monsters", what did Tom Hanks and his fellow social outcasts sit around the table and play? D&D.

Hysteria?