d20 Future Supplements?

[Ralts Bloodthorne]

Well. The Brood has a bunch of d20 Future stuff that will be released after the d20 Future rules hit the SRD.

Right now, they will only be small "mini-PDF's", 3-10 pages in length, detailing equipment, vehicles, armors.

There will also be some civilization pdf's, and fun stuff.

Right now, there is:
3 power armor mini's
5 spaceship mini's
10 AdC/PrC mini's
3 civilizations
Alternate rules for Power Armor (Not Mecha, Power Armor)
4 races.

Not much, just minor stuff so far.

 

[Salcor]

Peterson,
Is there anymore information on what your D20 Modern Adventure Path is going to consist of? I definately like the sound of it, as well as the Powered Armore rules. How are they different from the D20 Mecha rules. Also when will the Adventure Path be released?

Salcor

 

[Peterson]

Peterson,
Is there anymore information on what your D20 Modern Adventure Path is going to consist of? I definately like the sound of it, as well as the Powered Armore rules. How are they different from the D20 Mecha rules. Also when will the Adventure Path be released?

Salcor

Well, the best I can give you at this time is think "Indiana Jones meets Spy Games meets Alias....meets Sleep Dep Creations". We're still trying to figure out how to "promote" it without giving away some pretty important clues to the players. This game will be pretty heavily conpiracy-themed, but not to the point of Paranoia (PCs can trust each other and some NPCs). The D20 Modern Adventure Path is very well researched, so your players will be able to identify with some of the ideas/places presented in the product - along with having (if the DM allows it) the possibility of gathering more "intelligence" based off out of game (real-life) research.

The D20 Modern Adventure Path will be broken into 5 separate pdf sales - averaging about 3 Adventures per "packet" - and sold for about $5 each. While this might seem alot (not sure if it does), remember you'll basically be buying a complete campaign for only $25 (just one of WotC's adventure paths cost about $10 and that's only one adventure! Though, admittedly, its in print). We will have detailed maps, fully-statted NPCs, a new feat or two, possibly a Prestige Class or Advanced Class, everything you would expect from big-budget Hardcover Products. We also plan on supporting it on our website with a dedicated message board, Q&A live chat after each packet release, possible web enhancements, etc etc etc.

Unfortunately, as for when it will be released: Since these adventures are so interwined and we plan on placing clues from the very start (clues you'll need to solve the last puzzle in fact), we must do a fairly complete outline of every adventure before releasing the first packet, in order to maintain continuity. Of course, there must be playtesting done as well, before it can be release, so don't expect the first packet to be available until Jan 2005. Again, we're a small company, doing this more as a hobby that happens to possibly pay, as opposed to a full-time/part-time job. However, once we are done, and the first packet is released - expect the following packets to be released about two - six weeks after one another (roughly by Summer 2005, you should have the complete Adventure Path).

As for the Power Armor Tool Kit, its going to address how to create personalized power armor from the ground up - from your basic suit to the power supply to the weapons you add. DMs will like this cause they can create mission-specific power armor, while players will enjoy creating their own personalized power armor. Once the D20 Future SRD comes out, I'll figure what mechanics need to be changed (we were developing a few too-similar ideas as WotC that might need reworking), and then its off to playtesting. While the playtesting is being done, I'll be working on the fluff - the words in between the mechanics - so that its not just charts and other DM-heavy information. We plan on hosting a few web enhancements that show how to convert the pdf into various other rule styles, so that you'll (hopefully) be able to find a rule set that fits your needs.

Finally, as to how the P.A. Tool Kit is different from D20 Future's Mecha rules is that for one, Large will be the biggest sized suit available (if you follow the rules, that is) and Medium will be the smallest. Also, we have a different idea than using Equipment Slots, and the amount of "slots" you will have available will change based on which base suit you choose and what items you add. There's a lot more I can get into, but I won't. However, any suggestions can be emailed to me and/or I have my instant messenger handles available on the left. You can also find me in the ENWorld chatrooms, normally Eberron, D20 Future, and both D20 Modern rooms - I go by Peterson.

Sorry for the long post.

Thanks for the interest folks (especially you, Salcor), and for your time,

Peterson

 

[The Black Kestrel]

We plan on hosting a few web enhancements that show how to convert the pdf into various other rule styles, so that you'll (hopefully) be able to find a rule set that fits your needs.

So will you be tackling a D20 Mecha conversion? I'm enamored with that system and don't plan on using D20 Future's mecha rules at all. So I'll ask the perennial question. Why should I but the PA Toolkit?

 

[Peterson]

So will you be tackling a D20 Mecha conversion? I'm enamored with that system and don't plan on using D20 Future's mecha rules at all. So I'll ask the perennial question. Why should I but the PA Toolkit?

First off - I'm not touching D20 Mecha rules (from D20 Future). Those rules are good enough for Mecha, which (in my opinion) is not Power Armor. Power Armor is a totally different animal where I am concerned.

On to the perennial question:

If you think the Mecha rules covers power armor fairly well, don't buy the PA Toolkit. (I don't at all, but I do like most of it for building actual Mecha.)

If you think the Gadget system covers power armor fairly well, don't buy the PA Toolkit. (I think it's an awesome mechanic, but falls short in regards to Power Armor).

If you wish that Power Armor got addressed better, or you want to create multiple combat and non-combat versions of Power Armor, buy the PA Toolkit.

Basically, the PA Toolkit is basically just an option for DM/Players who want a more in-depth look at how to design/build Power Armor. The Mecha rules, while good, are - I feel - too clumsy to accurately portray how agile true power armor is. What I consider true power armor is a set of personal armor - no more than 16' in height - that is humaniod in shape and enhances the operator in some manner. True power armor is meant (again, my opinion) to be the ultimate in urban warfare - its not about who has the biggest gun or the biggest suit, but rather how well it performs in an urban setting with the smallest amount of collateral damage. Let's face it - 24' Mechas, or even the 16' Power Armor I suggest - are going to damage buildings - accidental or not. True, the 12' or even 6' suit of Power Armor still has the very real possibility of damaging buildings, but the smaller ones (6'-8') can actually move inside most buildings. They can still give those soldiers an advantage, even when they need to enter an enemy stronghold covertly.

This is just little bit of why I'm doing this really. Another part is that I needed a set of mechanics to build power armor for a campaign I'm building and figured, "Hey, since I'm creating the rules set already, why not see if people would want to buy it?". If I didn't think it was a good enough idea that someone would want it somewhere, I wouldn't be doing this.

Finally, once I read the rules on creating Large Mecha and Power Armor (via the gadget system) in D20 Future, I realized it didn't have the mechanics I needed to do what I wanted (especially the Equipment Slots mechanic - too limited at 7), so I'm going to go ahead with the PA Toolkit (which actually only its working title). There was almost enough customization in both sets of mechanics, but overall - there wasn't the feel I was looking for.

Hope this answers your question, at least a little.
Thanks again for your time,

Peterson

 

[Olive]

First off - I'm not touching D20 Mecha rules (from D20 Future). Those rules are good enough for Mecha, which (in my opinion) is not Power Armor.

I think he meant the book D20Mecha, not the mecha rules from D20 Future...

If you think the Gadget system covers power armor fairly well, don't buy the PA Toolkit. (I think it's an awesome mechanic, but falls short in regards to Power Armor).

Is it a problem with the system, or with the lack of gadgets?

'cos here's what I think...

People are hung up on the fac that there are limited types of armur and weapons in the book. This is because they see three guns and 2 types of armour at each PL. Then they look at their comy of Weapons Locker or Ultramodern Firearms and go 'there's no guns there's no armour!'.

This is because they're being silly. The gadgets sytem has one problem: there aren't enough gadgets! What DMs need to do to create a more 'realistic' weapons market is to sit down for half an hour and make up a series of gns:

Mk-43 Dragonblaster: laser pistol with x, y and z gadets
JRK-01 Clubpistol: cocussion rifle witht eh diminutive and stun setting gadgets etc.

and so forth...

Perhaps they should have included gadgets to increase range by 10', and increase damage die size, with coresponding wealth Dc increases? But a GM can make them himself, and with those tools make a whole gun shop of weaponry, all with different names etc, and go fromt here...

People sometimes have a hardtime seeing mechanics as the things you use to create fluff. they put fighter levels on a dragon and say that it's a dragon trained as a fighter, rather than just looking at the mechanics as the ebst way to create their ideas. It seems to me that the gadget system is an enourmously flexible system with near limitess possibility, perhaps put forward in a way that means that people hve a hard time seeing its potential. D20 Future didn't have room to include all the gadgets it could have, but that doesn't break the system...

Anyway, that rant was only slightly tangiental to your post, but I needed to get it off my chest!

 

[Peterson]

I think he meant the book D20Mecha, not the mecha rules from D20 Future...

Oh. Oops. Then I have no clue, cause I haven't picked up that book.

Is it a problem with the system, or with the lack of gadgets?

People sometimes have a hardtime seeing mechanics as the things you use to create fluff. they put fighter levels on a dragon and say that it's a dragon trained as a fighter, rather than just looking at the mechanics as the ebst way to create their ideas. It seems to me that the gadget system is an enourmously flexible system with near limitess possibility, perhaps put forward in a way that means that people hve a hard time seeing its potential. D20 Future didn't have room to include all the gadgets it could have, but that doesn't break the system...

Anyway, that rant was only slightly tangiental to your post, but I needed to get it off my chest!

Olive,

To be completely honest - after I saw your post in (I believe) another thread that I wrote in, I took a good look at the Gadget System, wondering if indeed it was going to work for what I had in mind. Sadly, the answer is no. While it is very flexible and just needs more gadgets to make the mechanic really stand out, it's not going to do what I want it to do for Power Armor.

Power Armor, in my Sci Fi game, is going to be plently dominant, very common place. Looking at all the new mechanics (and not so new ones) in both D20 Modern and D20 Future, I still see limitations in regards to Power Armor. Limitations that will not allow me to build most of the Power Armor I have envisioned. So, I'm writing my own guide to building power armor - from the ground up, so to speak.

Hope that explains some things, but if not - ask away (perfer email, so as not to hijack the thread). I'll answer what I can.

Peterson

 

[Salcor]

Peterson,
I like what I am hearing about the D20 Modern adventure path. Always a supporter of a continous storyline for the characters. As for the Powered Armor system, it sounds like a good idea, but I would recommend to get the D20 Mecha book from Guardians of Order and take a look at it first. They have a pretty good system for making powered armor, mechs, and vehicles. There are a few gliches with the system that could worked out (and they have been in errata), but I would take a look at it and see if it is going to do what you are looking for.

Olive,
I definately like what you are saying about the gadget system for the weapons and armor, and will have to look into that option a little more as I start moving towards my Future eras. It is actually along a line of thinking that I was going with Dragonstar, and I will have to explore it in more depth. Thanks for the insight.


Salcor

 

[Olive]

Hope that explains some things

Yeah it does. If powered armour is that central, I can understand why you'd want a whole new system...

I definately like what you are saying about the gadget system for the weapons and armor, and will have to look into that option a little more as I start moving towards my Future eras. It is actually along a line of thinking that I was going with Dragonstar, and I will have to explore it in more depth. Thanks for the insight.

No problem. Now I'm at home, I'll give an example of what I mean, actually using the book:

Here's the JRK-01 Clubpistol:
JRK-01 Clubpistol
Damage: 2d10+special/stun+special
Crit: 20
Dam Type: Concussion
Range Inc: 20'
Rate of Fire: S
Magazine: -
Size: Meddium
Weight: 3lb
Purchase DC: 26
Restriction: Lic (+1)

With its ingenious combination concussion and stun technology, as well as its manageable size, this pistol is the standard weapon of choice for the Colonial Police of New Terra. Its ability to both repel rioters as well as knock them unconcious is highly valued, as is the significant amount of damage that the weapon can do when that is what is needed.
This pistol uses the same concussion technology as the concussion rifle (D20F p72), and does concussion damage accordingly. When set to stun, the target must make a Fort save (DC 12) or be stunned for 1d4 rounds. In adition, role for damage in order to calculate the effects of the concussion technology.

So that's a much more complete weapon entry. Sure, it's kind of a pain to have to do that for every thing, but the book is a toolkit.

In terms of making weapons with increased range or different damage dice, GMs should probably just muck around. Maybe make a plasma sniper rifle with a 120' range for Purchase DC 21, or a plasma rifle with 100' range and 3d8 damage for the normal DC (or even 1 or 2 less)?

It's a pretty flexible system...

 

[The Black Kestrel]

Oh. Oops. Then I have no clue, cause I haven't picked up that book.

You should check out the SRD that GoO has released on thier website. It
might have what you're looking for. That bieng said my question was more along the lines of:

There are already three different systems for designing Mecha/ Power Armor (D20F Mecha, D20F Gadget Systems and GoO's D20 Mecha) . You're going to be adding a fourth. Why should I abandon or adapt one of the systems I'm already using?

Don't get me wrong, I love PA (fond memories of RTG's Maximum Metal) in my games. Some of my fondest gaming memories are of an Appleseed inspired Mekton campaign where we were members of E-SWAT.

I'd happily buy another supplement if it was well thought out, had creative designs and was compatible with at least one of the existing systems.