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Darksun Teasers

Obryn

Hero
I have some problems with Devas, Drow, Eladrins and some of the funky D&Di options (Revenant, Warforged, etc). I might disallow them in my game.
Devas I wouldn't forbid, but I'd discourage. Shifters could be around somewhere else on Athas, so I'm okay with them.

I have to disagree with you on Warforged, though. Athasian Warforged would freaking rock. :)

1. No Divine power source. This means no Avengers, Clerics, Invokers, or Paladins. (I would have to reread the original box set to see how I would come up with the Templar class)
Quick & Dirty cleric: Pick an element to worship. Instead of Radiant damage, you deal [Element] Damage. Your powers still burn the crap out of undead. Go forth and burn/drown/suffocate/bury stuff. Add a Channel Divinity feat for your element to summon it, and take it instead of ... whatever clerics get other than Turn Undead.

I am otherwise waiting to see what they do with the divine classes... I'd be fine with a "There are few, if any divine classes. Your character might be the only one" type deal, if necessary.

-O
 

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Wik

First Post
Mmm. Allow me to state why I - and, I assume, the others who agree with me - find the idea of a drastically changed Dark Sun to be so distasteful.

It's not because of the "purity of the setting." It's because of what becomes the new baseline. If I talk about Dark Sun, others around me will not think about the old version, they will think of the 4e version - with all the changes that come with it. It's the same tiefling problem. When I talk about tieflings in god knows what has to be the nerdiest conversations imaginable, and start talking about outsiders, I get blank looks. A while back, there was a thread where someone mentioned that Paizo was having difficulties finding an artist to draw a tiefling, as all the ones that responded did 4e styled ones.

That's why I'm so..."displeased" with the idea of a drastically changed Dark Sun. Because, quite frankly, yes. A new Dark Sun would prevent me from potentially playing an old one.

I'm sorry, but that argument is a bit flawed. Minor changes to the setting do not really change anything that's come before, or will come later. Just because there (may) be Tieflings in 4e DS, doesn't mean that when you get together to play 2e Dark Sun, they're going to be there because the DM happened to play 4e DS first and feels they should be there. Or, if 5e DS comes out, that they'll necessarily be there.

So long as the fundamentals of the setting remain (it's a desert, it's bleak, defiling exists, there are no gods, there are few planes, city-states, bugs and reptile monsters instead of mammals, etc...), it will be roughly the same experience.

Or, to put it another way, the revised Dark Sun setting made a hell of a lot more changes to original Dark Sun than the 4e Dark Sun will be making to the same original base line. The revised setting put in a greening process, killed off a lot of sorcerer kings (and made many more city-states basically barred from play), added races, and more. Does that mean that when people only play the revised setting, that they cannot play original Dark Sun? Does it mean that you are unable to run an Original Dark Sun adventure?

No, of course not. You can, and have been able to for fifteen odd years. If someone is only familiar with the revised Dark Sun, they can still play (and get the fundamentals you describe) - all you need to do is say "hey, you can't be an Aarokocra or Pterran, and the city-states are crazy messed up".

Or, to flip it, if you join a guy who is running revised 2e Dark Sun, and you're used to Original boxed set, you'll still feel like you're playing Dark Sun. Sure, Rhul-Thaun life-shaped artifacts might be a bit weird, and those piecemeal armour rules might seem odd... not to mention the new Psionics rules... but in the end, you're still going to be playing more or less the same game.

My point here is, the designers of 4e have already said they're basing things off the original boxed set. The blog post seems to suggest they're even lifting text straight from the Wanderer's Chronicle (which I'm all for). Even if they add in some minor tweaks like primordials, tieflings, dragonborn, small mountain ranges, justifiable silt sea, and the like, they won't be changing the setting any more than TSR did with the revised setting years ago.

Finally, you mention the 4e Eberron book was good. I agree. But I'm a bit confused... because the 4e Eberron book introduced more than a few changes to the setting - it added Tieflings and Dragonborn, for starters. And didn't it change the scale of the setting? And how Artificers work?

The point is, they made some changes to the setting to fit the new rules... and the sky didn't fall. Hell, you liked it.

For the record, I'm not saying the 4e Designers are going to make a perfect product. I honestly believe they're going to screw at least a few things up. But I have faith in what they release. Hell, even if they release a load of crap - a setting with metal weapons, non-cannibal halflings, planar Tieflings, Desert Devils, and Gods - it's going to be good. Because it will renew interest in a setting that has otherwise been dead for over ten years now. Meaning, even the worst possible product released will ultimately be a good thing for Dark Sun.
 

Korgoth

First Post
1. Gray text on white background: eyesore.
2. Tried 4E: think it sucks rocks.
3. Like original Dark Sun box but not 2nd box or PP books.
4. Had no problem with content of Baker's post.
 

vagabundo

Adventurer
I'm pumped by this post and hope to see more.

I like that they are thinking about the story of Dark Sun, but I hope that they leave a lot to the DM; having a possible, plausible background for something is cool, but keep that for the campaign guide.

I want to tell my players the story of Dark Sun, I kind don't want an official one; just a rumour of a story of a legend.

IMO the 4e setting wont overwrite the original, but could add to it.
 


Jack99

Adventurer
1. Gray text on white background: eyesore.
2. Tried 4E: think it sucks rocks.
3. Like original Dark Sun box but not 2nd box or PP books.
4. Had no problem with content of Baker's post.
I so misread nr 2 and wondered how on earth you weren't banned yet.. Must go wash my mind now.
 

Danzauker

Adventurer
Lizards are the predominant fauna in a desert setting. So Dragonborn don't come from dragons, they come from lizards. Easy fix, good fit.

Let's ALL face it.

Dragonborn are. Upright. Bulky. Reptiles. Tailless. With BOOBS.

They are ALREADY a Dark Sun-ish race shoehorned in 4e implied setting, not the other way round!

Change their name, flavor a bit the appearance, and they're done. It's a world full of strange reptiles and dinosaurs. A walking humanoid one does not appear out of place.

Same for tiefling. A good reskinning and they could even be the "new giths".

Just because there were the Cleansing Wars, that does not mean there can be some surviving races (in facts, we know for sure that there are). Some can just be so rare or hidden that the PC will be the sterotypical "only good drow ranger in the realms".


P.S. count me in the "statistical ininfluent" group of fervent Dark Sun lovers from good old times that are really looking forward for the next edition.
 

I liked the old Dark sun idea... but this setting was unplayable:

1. Attributes: low level fighters with strength 24 and others with 14 strength meant a too great imbalance...

2. Psionic rules in 2nd edition sounded great but played not so well...

3. Going out in the desert means you get eaten alive by wandering monsters if the DM holds true to any assumption about the ecology

So what do i expect from 4e Dark sun:

1. Keep the flavour of Dark Sun

2. make the settings mechanics so that the heroes can actually survive this setting reasonably

3. not a DS thing but a 4e thing: make Psionics a part of the core rules which don´t add a new weird thing to every character. (The new Psion adds a new kkind of mechanic, but only relevant to the psion, balance to other characters is kept)
 

1. The text is unreadable.
2. From what has been side it is going the mangled rout I thought it would
3. I will morn the massacre of yet another setting to 4e alter
4. For those that are pumped about it, I hope you really do enjoy it.
 

Dice4Hire

First Post
I am going to think seriously of buying it when it comes out, and am running a 3.5 version as soon as the players get their characters done......

One of my players bought all the Dark Sun stuff years ago, when it came out, and we ran a bit then, but not a lot. He is the main impetus for me doing it now

FOr the 4E version, I just do not see it being a good fit, unless some 4E assumptions are eleiminated or changed. I really hop they do change 4E a bit to the setting, as I would like to see the setting trump 4E rather than the other way around as it was with the last two settings.

But, yes, I am looking forward to it.
 

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