Dealing with unthankful players
- Thread starter Owain
- Start date
StreamOfTheSky
Adventurer
I like the idea of having them run some games.
Alternatively, if you're having fun with the other three...just play with them only. If you're worried 3 makes too small a group, let them use the Gestalt rules. Gestalt's a lot of fun, it'd be a nice reward for being appreciative players to let them tinker with dual class combinations.
Alternatively, if you're having fun with the other three...just play with them only. If you're worried 3 makes too small a group, let them use the Gestalt rules. Gestalt's a lot of fun, it'd be a nice reward for being appreciative players to let them tinker with dual class combinations.
Aus_Snow
First Post
Are those two like that in general (i.e., less grateful and gracious/thankful, on the whole) ? If so, there's your answer. Most likely.
And if not, are they being really disruptive throughout the actual sessions? Or are they just being ungrateful wretches outside the game, and whining a bit here and there? In the first instance, try talking with them about the problem, levelly and firmly, and see if you can get to the bottom of what's eating them*; get them to cough it up, so maybe it can be reasoned through or around. In the second instance, feh, never mind; that they're still turning up to play says a lot, right? Unless your patience/sensitivity can't withstand it of course, and then, you might want to default to the first instance's solution.
It sounds like you're doing well as a DM, either way. Good luck!
* Unless, yeah, as has been mentioned, they are simply powergamers, and you and the others are not. At which point, you gotta decide whether that's cool with you (and the others).
And if not, are they being really disruptive throughout the actual sessions? Or are they just being ungrateful wretches outside the game, and whining a bit here and there? In the first instance, try talking with them about the problem, levelly and firmly, and see if you can get to the bottom of what's eating them*; get them to cough it up, so maybe it can be reasoned through or around. In the second instance, feh, never mind; that they're still turning up to play says a lot, right? Unless your patience/sensitivity can't withstand it of course, and then, you might want to default to the first instance's solution.
It sounds like you're doing well as a DM, either way. Good luck!
* Unless, yeah, as has been mentioned, they are simply powergamers, and you and the others are not. At which point, you gotta decide whether that's cool with you (and the others).
Last edited:
Gilladian
Adventurer
You've been given a lot of replies here, but one that has been missed, is to GIVE THEM what they think they want!
Stop, tell the PCs you have an idea for a SUPER one-shot adventure, and you want to run it in x weeks.
Have them create characters of some high level (10th if that's high for your group, or even 15th or higher). Let them equip the characters to the MAX according to player wealth rules, and then GIVE each of them some "super item" of your own design.
Then run them through a nice, easy lower-level dungeon that presents no challenge to them. Let them smash everything. Give them tons of loot. Every time there's a rules question, just say "of course it works your way" and make a favorable, easy, walk-all-over-it ruling.
When they ask what's going on, tell them you're certain it is just what they've been asking for for the past few months. Be serious. You're not kidding, or being dishonest. You're meeting their every demand. Give exactly the same treatment to ALL the players.
I bet they'll have a blast for about 3 hours, and then get bored. At the end, ask them if they would like to DM for a while, or if they'd like to keep playing this game ad infinitem, or go back to the regular campaign where there is at least a modicum of control and challenge to the game....
(And then doublecheck to be sure you're not being a skinflint; and raise the difficulty/death level a tiny bit - if they're slightly more in fear of death, they may be less inclined to gripe about treasure and such).
Stop, tell the PCs you have an idea for a SUPER one-shot adventure, and you want to run it in x weeks.
Have them create characters of some high level (10th if that's high for your group, or even 15th or higher). Let them equip the characters to the MAX according to player wealth rules, and then GIVE each of them some "super item" of your own design.
Then run them through a nice, easy lower-level dungeon that presents no challenge to them. Let them smash everything. Give them tons of loot. Every time there's a rules question, just say "of course it works your way" and make a favorable, easy, walk-all-over-it ruling.
When they ask what's going on, tell them you're certain it is just what they've been asking for for the past few months. Be serious. You're not kidding, or being dishonest. You're meeting their every demand. Give exactly the same treatment to ALL the players.
I bet they'll have a blast for about 3 hours, and then get bored. At the end, ask them if they would like to DM for a while, or if they'd like to keep playing this game ad infinitem, or go back to the regular campaign where there is at least a modicum of control and challenge to the game....
(And then doublecheck to be sure you're not being a skinflint; and raise the difficulty/death level a tiny bit - if they're slightly more in fear of death, they may be less inclined to gripe about treasure and such).
Rodrigo Istalindir
Explorer
Here's one piece of related advice:
Think of the time spent on game prep, the wiki, detailing your home-brew, etc., as unrelated to the game. Do them because you enjoy the world-building, not because you expect the players to appreciate it. It's nice if they do, but a lot of players just want to play, they don't need or want a ton of backstory and detail. Those that do want those things might feel constrained or painted into corners by your efforts to script their histories in your side stories.
Look at that time spent as time spent enjoying your hobby, not as a chore and a consequent obligation on the part of your players to respect the time you spent away from the table. You'll be a lot happier.
And welcome to ENWorld!
Think of the time spent on game prep, the wiki, detailing your home-brew, etc., as unrelated to the game. Do them because you enjoy the world-building, not because you expect the players to appreciate it. It's nice if they do, but a lot of players just want to play, they don't need or want a ton of backstory and detail. Those that do want those things might feel constrained or painted into corners by your efforts to script their histories in your side stories.
Look at that time spent as time spent enjoying your hobby, not as a chore and a consequent obligation on the part of your players to respect the time you spent away from the table. You'll be a lot happier.
And welcome to ENWorld!
Rel
Liquid Awesome
This.
Enjoy the work you put into the game for its own sake and don't do it because you expect to somehow be repaid with player gratitude.
Obryn
Hero
Have you thought of hopping out of the D&D game and trying something else for a few sessions? Look into Savage Worlds, Call of Cthulhu, M&M, Buffy/Angel, Star Wars, Warhammer FRP, or even (especially?) something like Paranoia for a one-shot. Or, heck, even one of the many freely available retro-clones like S&W or OSRIC. Then, segue back into the 3e D&D campaign that is, by all appearances, your gaming passion.
Sometimes a change of pace is all you need to keep your games feeling new and exciting.
I've found it helps my DMing a lot, and my players like doing something different once in a while.
-O
Sometimes a change of pace is all you need to keep your games feeling new and exciting.
I've found it helps my DMing a lot, and my players like doing something different once in a while.-O
billd91
Not your screen monkey (he/him) 🇺🇦🇵🇸🏳️⚧️
You have piqued my curiosity. Any more details you feel comfortable giving out? How did you "screw up" (if, in fact, you did) and how did that lead to accusations of favoritism?
Agree with Rodrigo and Rel. No one cares how much you work on your game.
That isn't a bad thing, its just how things are. Imagine you go to see a stand up comedian, and he tells a joke that isn't funny. When no one laughs, he starts telling you how long he worked on that joke, he put hours and hours into it. Does that make the joke funnier? No. Neither does you explaining how much work you put into the game matter, apart from your enjoyment of doing so.
I like the idea of having them run some games, not to throw it back at them but to see what they do. I believe that everyone runs the kind of game they wish they were playing in. It could be very educational. See if you can get them to do it for this reason - lets take a break and have you guys run awhile, so I can see what you think makes for a fun game!
That isn't a bad thing, its just how things are. Imagine you go to see a stand up comedian, and he tells a joke that isn't funny. When no one laughs, he starts telling you how long he worked on that joke, he put hours and hours into it. Does that make the joke funnier? No. Neither does you explaining how much work you put into the game matter, apart from your enjoyment of doing so.
I like the idea of having them run some games, not to throw it back at them but to see what they do. I believe that everyone runs the kind of game they wish they were playing in. It could be very educational. See if you can get them to do it for this reason - lets take a break and have you guys run awhile, so I can see what you think makes for a fun game!
Man, the people on ENWorld are awesome. You've got a lot of great advice here.
While there's been a lot of talk about burnout, my own take on it is that you're suffering more from poor players than from burning out. That is, it seems to me that if the two players you described were more like the other three, there wouldn't be a problem at all.
If that's the case, then I would question your assumption that "I can't kick them out because they're friends." I love dnd, and one of my best friends is in a dnd game. That game is very heavy on roleplaying, and I'm more into combat, so I never received an invitation. I wasn't hurt, the friendship wasn't hurt -- it just makes sense. When you talk to these two guys, say, "Look, it's obvious that I'm not running the game you want to play and you're not playing the game I want to run. I'd love to play in some of your games if you want to take a shot at DM-ing, but as for the main campaign, I think everybody would be a lot happier if it continued without you."
While there's been a lot of talk about burnout, my own take on it is that you're suffering more from poor players than from burning out. That is, it seems to me that if the two players you described were more like the other three, there wouldn't be a problem at all.
If that's the case, then I would question your assumption that "I can't kick them out because they're friends." I love dnd, and one of my best friends is in a dnd game. That game is very heavy on roleplaying, and I'm more into combat, so I never received an invitation. I wasn't hurt, the friendship wasn't hurt -- it just makes sense. When you talk to these two guys, say, "Look, it's obvious that I'm not running the game you want to play and you're not playing the game I want to run. I'd love to play in some of your games if you want to take a shot at DM-ing, but as for the main campaign, I think everybody would be a lot happier if it continued without you."
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