D&D 5E Death from Exhaustion

[epithet]

So, level 6 exhaustion is "death." I'm wondering how best to handle this mechanically, especially in circumstances where an event would drop that last level of exhaustion on the target in an instant.

One possibility is that "death" in this context would mean the exhausted creature's hit point maximum would be 0, but that it could become "stable" as normal. The target would have disadvantage on the death saving throws from the level 3, obviously. An application of the spare the dying cantrip would also apply the stable condition, as would a medicine check or a healer's kit. I suppose any magical healing would also just make the creature stable, since the hit point max would still be 0. After 8 hours, the creature would gain 1 hit point and lose 1 level of exhaustion.

The other possibility is that "death" means no possibility of becoming stable at 0. So, what happens when a revivify spell is cast on the creature? Does he come back with 5 levels of exhaustion?

How does the death ward spell interact with the 6th level of exhaustion? Would it just void out whatever caused it, or should the creature be stable and unconscious at 0 instead of having 1 hit point?

I'm much less interested in an interpretation of "rule as written" than in a mechanical approach that makes sense. I'm tempted to lean on exhaustion as an effect for homebrewed torments to inflict upon my hapless players, so I need clarity on how I want to handle "death" by exhaustion.

 

[Guest 6801328]

I would go with a sudden, devastating explosion.

 

[jaelis]

So, level 6 exhaustion is "death." I'm wondering how best to handle this mechanically, especially in circumstances where an event would drop that last level of exhaustion on the target in an instant.

One possibility is that "death" in this context would mean the exhausted creature's hit point maximum would be 0, but that it could become "stable" as normal. The target would have disadvantage on the death saving throws from the level 3, obviously. An application of the spare the dying cantrip would also apply the stable condition, as would a medicine check or a healer's kit. I suppose any magical healing would also just make the creature stable, since the hit point max would still be 0. After 8 hours, the creature would gain 1 hit point and lose 1 level of exhaustion.

The other possibility is that "death" means no possibility of becoming stable at 0. So, what happens when a revivify spell is cast on the creature? Does he come back with 5 levels of exhaustion?

How does the death ward spell interact with the 6th level of exhaustion? Would it just void out whatever caused it, or should the creature be stable and unconscious at 0 instead of having 1 hit point?


I'm much less interested in an interpretation of "rule as written" than in a mechanical approach that makes sense. I'm tempted to lean on exhaustion as an effect for homebrewed torments to inflict upon my hapless players, so I need clarity on how I want to handle "death" by exhaustion.

It says you're dead, not unconscious. So no 0 hp dodge (unless you just want to play it that way.) I would say that if the creature is subsequently raised, it has no levels of exhaustion. But if you want to say revivify leaves them at 5 levels, that wouldn't be crazy. I would definitely say raise dead or better would remove all exhaustion though.

Death ward would negate whatever effect caused the 6th level of exhaustion, per the spell. That would leave the character at 5 levels, with however many hp he has. Of course, if the thing causing exhaustion is still going on, then that only buys you a little time.

 

[Illithidbix]

For whatever reason, there seems to be a metaphysical difference between inflicted injuries and gradually being run down by a failure to eat, drink and rest.
And healing magic finds it far far easier to deal with the former. How much you want this ingrained in the world... is up to you.

Death by starvation, dehydration or sleep deprivation you can sorta understand
There are some particular odder cases with exhaustion from the environment such as death by prolonged exposure to extreme heat or cold is apparently fundamentally different from injuries from fire or cold damage, at least as far as magic is concerned.

From my interpretation the character is dead the moment they hit level 6 exhaustion, the "dying" has likely to already have taken far longer as they accumulate the exhaustion levels.

To me Death Ward *doesn't* stop death by exhaustion

The first time the target would drop to 0 hit points as a result of taking damage, the target instead drops to 1 hit point, and the spell ends.

Because the target doesn't take damage, they gain exhaustion and don't drop to 0 hp. It doesn't work for the same reason that Cure Wounds doesn't work.

The Greater Restoration Metric
Also Death Ward is a "mere" 4th Level Abjuration and to remove *just a single level of exhaustion* takes a 5th Level Abjuration (Greater Restoration) which has the material component: "diamond dust worth at least 100 gp, which the spell consumes"

There is also the (very rare) Potion of Vitality.
When you drink this potion, it removes any exhaustion you are suffering and cures any disease or poison affecting you. For the next 24 hours, you regain the maximum number of hit points for any Hit Die you spend. The potion's crimson liquid regularly pulses with dull light, calling to mind a heartbeat.


If you want to just be *nicer* to your players, feel free to have Death Ward work.

Revivify
My *literal* reading of Revivify implies it might not work... but then the same could be said for True Resurrection and I don't think that's quite the intent.

Whilst Revivfy is only a level 3 spell (see the point about Greater Restoration) Revivify requires material component of diamonds worth 300 gp, which the spell consumes. I would be happy for it to bring someone back to life with 5 levels of exhaustion.

Going a bit further on from what rationale you want if your using it in your game...
In my worlds, I tend to go with the idea that Magical Healing does not work very effectively on most "normal" NPCs
This is mostly a specific detail for my last campaign, where magic is mostly just a legend and the PC are superhuman "Unfettered" (i.e have classes and levels and memories of ancient times), because D&D characters *are* superhuman.

If an "normal" NPC is wounded and dying then healing magic will *help a bit... maybe* but you can't just Heal a dying NPC for 1 HP and expect to straight back to their feet like players do.

Sometimes the magic can save a NPC's life, although they're still probably going to be crippled by such critical injuries, perhaps permanently. Other times it may only ease pain and allow the NPC to live a little longer.
Mostly... yeah it's upto the DM's choice and what serves the narrative the best.

 

[jaelis]

To me Death Ward *doesn't* stop death by exhaustion

The first time the target would drop to 0 hit points as a result of taking damage, the target instead drops to 1 hit point, and the spell ends.

Because the target doesn't take damage, they gain exhaustion and don't drop to 0 hp.

Sure but there's the next paragraph: "If the spell is still in effect when the target is subjected to an effect that would kill it instantaneously without dealing damage, that effect is instead negated against the target, and the spell ends." Sure seems like that should apply, doesn't it?

 

[The Crimson Binome]

Sure but there's the next paragraph: "If the spell is still in effect when the target is subjected to an effect that would kill it instantaneously without dealing damage, that effect is instead negated against the target, and the spell ends." Sure seems like that should apply, doesn't it?

Exhaustion is more of a condition than an effect. An effect might cause exhaustion, and if that kills you then Death Ward might negate it, but starvation is slow enough that it should get around that.

Another way to think of it is that exhaustion is similar to being on fire or aging, in that it kills you over time, and if you only negate the instant that's actually fatal then it will reset you back to the point where you're six seconds away from dying. (Unless you want to say that Death Ward resets you all the way back to before you were set on fire, before you stopped eating, or before you were born.)

 

[Ahrimon]

Sure but there's the next paragraph: "If the spell is still in effect when the target is subjected to an effect that would kill it instantaneously without dealing damage, that effect is instead negated against the target, and the spell ends." Sure seems like that should apply, doesn't it?

I can picture a cleric keeping himself alive for years sealed away by casting death ward every day. His body is gaunt and weak, but he survives through sheer will. =)

 

[Kabouter Games]

For whatever reason, there seems to be a metaphysical difference between inflicted injuries and gradually being run down by a failure to eat, drink and rest.

I don't think it's metaphysical at all. It's quite clear - one is hit points, the other isn't.

Exhaustion is more of a condition than an effect.

Precisely. Just like poisoned or restrained or whatever else is in the conditions list. After all, exhaustion is explicitly discussed in the PHB's appendix on conditions.

An effect imposes the condition of a level of exhaustion. So the text jaelis quoted doesn't apply. The effect doesn't kill it instantaneously. The effect imposes the condition of a level of exhaustion; that's what kills it. The spell text refers to things like insta-kill spells or items which don't involve damage.

Tangent: Are there any save-or-die mechanics anymore? I can't think of any.

Cheers,

Bob

 

[Ancalagon]

I can picture a cleric keeping himself alive for years sealed away by casting death ward every day. His body is gaunt and weak, but he survives through sheer will. =)

Can death ward protect you from death by old age? No? Then why starvation?

 

[GX.Sigma]

So, level 6 exhaustion is "death." I'm wondering how best to handle this mechanically, especially in circumstances where an event would drop that last level of exhaustion on the target in an instant...I'm much less interested in an interpretation of "rule as written" than in a mechanical approach that makes sense. I'm tempted to lean on exhaustion as an effect for homebrewed torments to inflict upon my hapless players, so I need clarity on how I want to handle "death" by exhaustion.

What's wrong with the literal interpretation? I don't understand the problem you're trying to solve here. It says "death;" is that not clear enough?