D&D 5E Decoupling ancestry and culture

[Haldrik]

My main goal is to note deviate too much from the core. I don't want to reinvent the wheel and that may be too much change for me.

The reason I mentioned it is, in the other thread, I suggested similar, using class and background to determine the ability adjustments − rather than race. Someone else (@TheSword) pointed out, if that is the case, and every Wizard gets +1 Intelligence and there is no race adjustment, then why not just remove all ability score adjustments. So if using pointbuy, and most Orcs have high Strength, but your Orc has high Intelligence, ... done. There is no real need for classes or races to give an adjustment.

 

[CubicsRube]

The reason I mentioned it is, in the other thread, I suggested similar, using class and background to determine the ability adjustments − rather than race. Someone else (@TheSword) pointed out, if that is the case, and every Wizard gets +1 Intelligence and there is no race adjustment, then why not just remove all ability score adjustments. So if using pointbuy, and most Orcs have high Strength, but your Orc has high Intelligence, ... done. There is no real need for classes or races to give an adjustment.

I agree with that myself. Although in think some people would miss ASIs

 

[Haldrik]

I agree with that myself. Although in think some people would miss ASIs

Exactly.


Improving abilities would still happen while leveling. But not adjusting "to get that 20" at level 1, takes reorienting.

 

[Kinematics]

@Kinematics Ultimately that's why i went the route above removing ability score increases from ancestry and put it into class. I think it's more interesting because for ability scores there'll be no difference between a half elf bard and a half orc bard.

What would be different is the racial features. A half orc bard might still be more inclined to make a melee college of swords bard, but can be just as viable mechanically if they don't go that route.

Yeah, I did see that, but I think that leans too far into the, "You must play this way!" assignment that caused WotC to decide against putting attribute increases in classes way back when. (I think Mearls discussed that issue in one of his Happy Fun Hour videos.)

For example, why do you have ranger getting +2 Wis/+1 Dex? Are you saying that the ranger must focus on casting first? And Wis isn't even an attribute that ranger has proficiency in. A ranger is more likely to want a +2 Dex, but Str is also viable.

In summary: Even if you put attribute bonuses in classes, there still needs to be a bit of flexibility. Even with the current system, you can always change your race to get a stat boost that fits what you're trying for, but if your attribute boosts are tied to the class, there's no adjustments you can make if you don't like those exact stat boosts.

 

[SkidAce]

In summary: Even if you put attribute bonuses in classes, there still needs to be a bit of flexibility. Even with the current system, you can always change your race to get a stat boost that fits what you're trying for, but if your attribute boosts are tied to the class, there's no adjustments you can make if you don't like those exact stat boosts.

I agree.

 

[CubicsRube]

Well the other option would be to just give everyone a free ASI at level 1 and leave it at that.

I'd be oerfectly happy however to just make it all point buy/standard array. I'm all for removing unncessary complexity

 

[FrogReaver]

I'm not confident there's any way to balance this.

 

[Kinematics]

I'm not confident there's any way to balance this.

It will certainly be difficult. Balancing the stats is actually the easy part. The difficult parts are things like races with a lower base speed, that are given other boosts to balance that out. However if you decouple ancestry from culture, you can't guarantee that that balance will be maintained.

If any race could pick up a culture that was balanced around the 'stats' of the base race, that would be unbalanced. For example, halflings have lower base speed, but get Halfling Nimbleness and Lucky. Those are clearly overpowered for a mere speed increase, but then you have to consider that the halfling subraces are very sparse; they don't get all the benefits that, say, the elves do in their subraces.

So to balance it all out you have to consider how much power is put into each segment of the creation. If halflings get Lucky as a race trait, how do you keep them from being overtuned if you combine them with an expansive culture like the various elf subraces?

Caveat: I haven't done a thorough analysis of the various combinations, nor am I sure of exactly what counts as balanced, within this scope.

 

[Horwath]

I would go with next solution to ability scores and features.

1. Race/genetic abilities
+1 bonus to one of 3 racial prefered abilities. I.E. elves get +1 to dex, int or wis

2. Background abilities. I.E. Outlander +1 to str, dex or con.

3. Class abilities. I.E. ranger; +1 to str, dex or wis.

Sum of ability boosts to a single ability from 3 steps cannot be higher than +2.

 

[Hoffmand]

Note I'm not trying to "FIX" D&D. I'm merely just toying with an idea that's appealing to me

Whatever works for you. Others may like it too. If they don’t like it they can skip it.