Demons and Devils, why only DR/good

[Pierson Lowgal]

If a Demon is Chaotic Evil, and from my understanding of Planescape and such settings, aren't Demons just as chaotic as they are evil?

If so (and even if not so), shouldn't Demons have damage reduction x / good or lawful ? And thus good or chaotic for Devils?

I think this choice by the designers shows an unnecessary good vs. evil bias, against lawful vs. chaotic.

Of course, this kind of thing really annoys my 13th level LN cleric.

 

[gfunk]

I think it's true that the designers consider the good/evil axis as a major component and law/chaos as the minor component.

But as far as your LN cleric is concerned, the 2nd level spell "Align Weapon" should take care of your DR woes. Since you are neutral, you can create either an "Evil" or "Good" weapon.

Also, this is not terribly germane to your concerns but really powerful demons have DR/good and cold iron and really powerful devils have DR/good and silver.

 

[orbitalfreak]

I don't think it would be too out of line to allow opposing alignments on either the Good-Evil or the Lawful-Chaotic axes to affect Demons/Devils.

DR x/good and cold iron would become
DR x/(good or lawful) and cold iron
DR y/good and silver would become
DR y/(good or chaotic) and silver

True, Align Weapon exists, but I think the alternate alignment DR rules would allow more flavour to come into the campaign. Also, this could tie in to the Blood War, where the Law and Chaos sides of Evil battle one another. The orderly Devils could pierce the DR of their anarchic foes without having to "taint" themselves with holy weapons. Law vs Chaos should be just as important as Good vs Evil.

// makes note to include this in his campaign's house rules...

 

[Vurt]

I think the design rationale was actually influenced by the idea of the Blood War. That is, if the demons and devils had DR that could be easily pierced in a melee with one another, the Blood War wouldn't necessarily need to have been going on for so long, and the participants wouldn't get so bent out of shape about it.

-- Vurt

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Of course, this kind of thing really annoys my 13th level LN cleric.

Why? He still can carry a holy weapon or align a weapon with the spell to be good. *But*, his attacks aren't lawful at all. He won't be able to overcome a titan's or slaad's DR, just because he's of lawful alignment, just as a paladin won't have any luck against a demon (unless he uses magic).

 

[Urbannen]

Yes, demons should have damage reduction X/good or law.



I vote for a 4th edition free of extraneous alignment components!

 

[Pierson Lowgal]

Thank you for your replies.

KaeYoss and gfunk,

regarding the spell Align Weapon and carrying Holy Weapons - that is what annoys my Cleric (and, well, me), he doesn't want to cast good spells or carry around holy magic weapons.

Through 3.0, he has nevercast a good spell, such as protection from evil or dispel evil, even though he does channel positive energy and it is (was) fully within the rules to take these spells. He has never even summoned a good aligned creature.

Now, with this change to damage reduction, he is now going to be compelled to cast the good-aligned spell, align-weapon-good, probably all the time.

Pierson

 

[Brekki]

You can always cast "swordbane" on your weapon ... will almost zero out the DR 10/...

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Thank you for your replies.

KaeYoss and gfunk,

regarding the spell Align Weapon and carrying Holy Weapons - that is what annoys my Cleric (and, well, me), he doesn't want to cast good spells or carry around holy magic weapons.

Through 3.0, he has nevercast a good spell, such as protection from evil or dispel evil, even though he does channel positive energy and it is (was) fully within the rules to take these spells. He has never even summoned a good aligned creature.

Now, with this change to damage reduction, he is now going to be compelled to cast the good-aligned spell, align-weapon-good, probably all the time.

Pierson

And he doesn't have to cast a [Good] spell. That's his choice. But he has to face the concequences of that.

Give him a devil (DR x/chaotic or good with the suggested change) and he'll have no choice after all.