Dervish Dance and Karmic Strike

[sledged]

If a dervish is hit while dancing does, she still have to move 5' between her AoO granted by Karmic Strike and her next attack?

 

[Kemrain]

I'd say no, and say that AoO's don't apply to the Dervish Dance, just as Cleave shouldn't.

Then again, I might be wrong.

- Kemrain the Wrong.

 

[RigaMortus]

What does Karmic Strike do? I've seen it mentioned a lot here...

 

[sledged]

What does Karmic Strike do? I've seen it mentioned a lot here...

By taking a -4 to AC, it allows a character to make an AoO against anyone that hits him with a melee attack.

 

[Tilla the Hun (work)]

If a dervish is hit while dancing does, she still have to move 5' between her AoO granted by Karmic Strike and her next attack?

Begs the question - how can a dervish be hit while dancing? I don't have the book available to me in the short term, but does the dancing ability say anything about aoo's? If it doesn't, then this question just went into the pile of yours called 'house rules'

In all honesty - I'd have to think 1) yes, the dervish can be hit by dancing in a similar fashion to a barbarian's whirlwind attack against a karmic strike feated fighter and 2) if hit, and possessing the KS feat, the dervish, as per KS, makes an 'immediate' melee attack of opportunity against the foe that hit her - this attack is an AoO, at her highest bab, etc. and does not count against her normal attacks and 3) she must then move 5' to continue her dance.

This is predicated on the assumption that you 'can' make AoO's during your actions... which is another realm I don't believe the rules quite cover (who would ever of dreamed the question would come up???)

KS should not be compared to cleave. Cleave is a special feat, special attack, with special/exceptional rules. KS provides the ability to use an AoO when hit. Rather a different thing, when you get into the technicalities.

FYI - this could get really nasty with two +5-8 dex mod KS feated fighters with one dervish dancing around the other when both possess Combat Reflexes....

8 attacks of opportunity and 8 normal attacks (2wf) later, the dervish ends her dance...

::shudder::

 

[Hypersmurf]

Begs the question - how can a dervish be hit while dancing?

So many ways.

Dervish provokes an AoO by making a Disarm attempt.
Dervish's opponent has a Readied action.
Dervish's opponent is also using Karmic Strike.

-Hyp.

 

[Darklone]

Nothing keeps a dervish from tumbling while "dancing" his dervish dance... single disadvantage: He might lose some of his attacks since he has to take a 5 ft step between two of his attacks...

 

[Tilla the Hun (work)]

I don't think the readied action would work too well.

Disarm, sunder, etc - sure - but are these allowed as part of the dance?

I typically (and correct me if I do this wrong) adjudicate readied actions as being an action readied to respond to a specific action on the enemies part... and you have to be careful of your phrasing in it as well. "I ready an action to trip the dervish if she hits me" means the dervish will hit you first, then you trip her - provided she actually 'hit' you "I ready an action to trip the dervish if she moves to attack me" means you trip her before she hits you - provided she moved to hit you. "I ready an action to trip her if she tries to hit me" might work...

An opponent with KS would definitely do the trick... until they ran out of AoO's... but I think I covered that earlier?

The question wasn't what could - but what was allowed by the dancing ability... did it restrict AoO's against or by the WD??... i.e. can a KS feated Dervish Dancing Whirling Dervish take an AoO during her dance?

If so - whoa! - way cool ... Dance for full attacks, and if hit, respond with trip & hit (imp trip, of course) on the now prone target....

Gads. I have to use this a villain now... Talk about nigh unstoppable spinning top fighter style

Now I have to go borrow the book again and find out

 

[sledged]

The question wasn't what could - but what was allowed by the dancing ability... did it restrict AoO's against or by the WD??... i.e. can a KS feated Dervish Dancing Whirling Dervish take an AoO during her dance?

No, I wasn't asking if a dervish can take an AoO during her dance (I just assumed that she could); I was asking does she have to take a 5' step after making an AoO before making her next attack. And just to be sure everyone knows the details of the dervish dance:

Dervish Dance (Ex): A dervish can become a whirling dancer of death a certain number of times per day. While in this dervish dance, she can make full attack action (for melee attacks only) and still move up to her speed. However, a dervish must move a minimum of 5 feet between each attack when using this ability, and she cannot return to a square she has just exited (though she may return to that square later during her full attack). The dervish is subject to attacks of opportunity while dancing, but may tumble normally as part of her move. A dervish prevented from completing her move is also prevented from finishing her full attack.

If a dervish wields a slashing weapon while in a dervish dance, she gains a bonus on her attack and damage rolls. This bonus is +1 at first level, and it increases by an extra +1 at ever odd-numbered level thereafter.

A dervish may only perform a dervish dance while wielding a slashing weapon (she may use a double weapon, or multiple weapons, only if both ends of the weapon or all weapons are of the slashing type). She cannot perform a dervish dance in any armor heavier than light or if she is using a shield. While dancing, a dervish cannot use any skills or abilities that involve concentration or require her to remain still, such as Move Silently, Hide, or Search. A dervish with bardic music ability can, however, sing while she dances, and a dervish can also use the Combat Expertise feat while in a dance. A dervish cannot perform a dervish dance while under the effect of a rage or frenzy ability.

A dervish can perform a dervish dance only once per encounter. A dervish dance lasts 1 round for every two ranks of Perform (dance) that the character has. At the end of a dervish dance, the character becomes fatigued for the duration of the encounter (unless she is a 9th-level dervish, at which point this limitation no longer applies).
​

It should be noted here that at 4th level the dervish gains the benefit of the cleave feat, but does not have to move 5' before making the extra attack.

Nothing keeps a dervish from tumbling while "dancing" his dervish dance... single disadvantage: He might lose some of his attacks since he has to take a 5 ft step between two of his attacks...

Given that most characters can move 20' or 30', that's still 5 or 7 attacks (not counting the attacks granted by the cleave ability at 4th level), and her movement increases as she gains more levels.

 

[Sleeping Dragon]

If so - whoa! - way cool ... Dance for full attacks, and if hit, respond with trip & hit (imp trip, of course) on the now prone target....

Gads. I have to use this a villain now... Talk about nigh unstoppable spinning top fighter style

Now I have to go borrow the book again and find out

Don't forget to give them the Elusive Target feat out of the Complete Warrior. Thanks to the Cause Overreach ability that feat grants you, you can, while dancing, deliberately draw AoOs from your opponents and, if they miss you, make a trip attack against them. Mix in Improved Trip and this just gets ugly