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Did you survive 1-20?
- Thread starter Plissken
- Start date
Jeff Wilder
First Post
I have an AD&D PC (thief-acrobat) who made it to 15th level without dying, including a trip through the original ToEE, back when it was first released.
I've made it to 20th level in the 3E era twice: once in Shackled City (mystic theurge; I think I died and was brought back twice, before being killed in the TPK finale), and once in Age of Worms (war hulk; I didn't die at all until the TPK in the penultimate encounter). Both campaigns lasted between two and three years.
I've made it to 20th level in the 3E era twice: once in Shackled City (mystic theurge; I think I died and was brought back twice, before being killed in the TPK finale), and once in Age of Worms (war hulk; I didn't die at all until the TPK in the penultimate encounter). Both campaigns lasted between two and three years.
Sorrowdusk
First Post
How often do people make it all the way through those Adventure paths without dying once? How many make it all the way through period?
This assumes that all of a campaigns encounters are combat encounters.
And lastly, what is so interesting is that it sounds like many people have never palyed beyond 10-11; they've never gone as far as 18-20 even if with dying and being raised. This seems to imply that a large portion of the published material (half of the monsters, upper level spells, upper level items) have never been seen in play by many people.
From what I have read, many people start at first and have a thing for the first five levels-although I dont like it.
This assumes that all of a campaigns encounters are combat encounters.
And lastly, what is so interesting is that it sounds like many people have never palyed beyond 10-11; they've never gone as far as 18-20 even if with dying and being raised. This seems to imply that a large portion of the published material (half of the monsters, upper level spells, upper level items) have never been seen in play by many people.
From what I have read, many people start at first and have a thing for the first five levels-although I dont like it.
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Hussar
Legend
Sorrowdusk - this isn't new at all. There's a reason pretty much every edition of the game has so little support on the high end. It's a viscious circle really - no one plays high level because the game has so little support, but, no one buys the support that's produced because no one plays those levels.
Add to that the fact that D&D gets ... wonky at very high levels. Extremely long combats, PC's that are virtually demi-gods in their own right, and possibly some serious balance issues between the classes means that the "sweet spot" in D&D is generally hovering between 3rd and 12th (give or take, depending on edition).
But gone 1 to 20 without dying once? Nope, never done that. Everyone's died, probably more than once. The paladin I mentioned upthread? Died a few times along the way. Always to poison as I recall.
Add to that the fact that D&D gets ... wonky at very high levels. Extremely long combats, PC's that are virtually demi-gods in their own right, and possibly some serious balance issues between the classes means that the "sweet spot" in D&D is generally hovering between 3rd and 12th (give or take, depending on edition).
But gone 1 to 20 without dying once? Nope, never done that. Everyone's died, probably more than once. The paladin I mentioned upthread? Died a few times along the way. Always to poison as I recall.
As a player the best I can remember is going 2-17 with a mage in RttToEE; and he drowned twice. He probably would have gone up to 20 but the party found a Deck of Many Things. Everything went supprisingly well until the cleric drew change alignment, lose powers, and fight a minor death. The cleric fell to his knees and shouted, "Tharizdun you new servant calls to you: Aid me in my hour of need!" He arose, eyes flashing with demoniac light, and dissapeared in a puff of acrid smoke. The following war of arcane and divine might consumed us both as well as the party, the temple, and the campaign. It actually turned out to be a satisfying ending.
As a DM I have only had one PC make it from 1st to a high level without being able to kill it. A halfling thief, definitely the luckiest glass cannon I have ever seen.
As a DM I have only had one PC make it from 1st to a high level without being able to kill it. A halfling thief, definitely the luckiest glass cannon I have ever seen.
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2e - I never broke level 10, though I had a couple of characters get to upper single digits.
3e - Living Greyhawk, one character made it to lvl 14 (over the course of about 4 years, playing at many game days and conventions). One home campaign character made it up to 12th (over the course of about 2 years of almost weekly play). I ran one campaign where the characters made it to 12th (over the course of 2 years). None of the other games I played in broke 10th.
4e - I've only played up to mid-heroic tier, I've done this in two campaigns. I am running a home campaign and the characters are almost lvl 20 (after a little over 2 years playing biweekly, but with many sessions in the 8-12 hour range).
3e - Living Greyhawk, one character made it to lvl 14 (over the course of about 4 years, playing at many game days and conventions). One home campaign character made it up to 12th (over the course of about 2 years of almost weekly play). I ran one campaign where the characters made it to 12th (over the course of 2 years). None of the other games I played in broke 10th.
4e - I've only played up to mid-heroic tier, I've done this in two campaigns. I am running a home campaign and the characters are almost lvl 20 (after a little over 2 years playing biweekly, but with many sessions in the 8-12 hour range).
InVinoVeritas
Adventurer
The highest level character I have ever played or DMed since 2000 (and possibly earlier) is 5th level.
Most of the optimization threads, prestige class discussions, worries about CoDzilla or wizards that can do anything... don't exist at all when you can never rise above 5th.
Most of the optimization threads, prestige class discussions, worries about CoDzilla or wizards that can do anything... don't exist at all when you can never rise above 5th.
Sorrowdusk
First Post
Well-do people actually play most of the things they talk about? Or is it all hypothetical?
Sorrowdusk
First Post
And here's just a random thought but, has anyone just...started at 20th level? I know epic play isnt for everyone, but Wizards seems to think (in 4E) at least it ought to be an option to be considered.
Dungeons & Dragons Roleplaying Game Official Home Page - Article (E1 Death's Reach)
Dungeons & Dragons Roleplaying Game Official Home Page - Article (E1 Death's Reach)
It seems odd to me that so many people have never done this, as it makes up the bulk of my gaming adventures. I have had three characters that reached that level. My first was a 2e human fighter/mage that I took from 1st to 20th in the late 80s/ early 90s. His successor, a half-elf fighter/mage/thief, was the next one, and my longest running character to date having made it 36th level. I stepped behind the screen at that point, and I didn't get to play for several years. When I finally did, I began playing my current player character: a 3.5 dwarven blackguard who is currently 24th level, with a break down of fighter 6/blackguard 10/cleric 8. One kind of neat thing to note about him is that the rest of the group has changed type (undead, outsider, elemental, etc) in the course of their careers, but he is still humanoid, albeit considerably augmented through the use of magic tattoos, potions, and other magic items.
A side note, I know a lot of people have issues with epic level play in 3.5. For my group, it works. It slows them down, which is a good thing. They do this thing, and I am guilty of it as well, where we think way outside the box. After third level, it becomes a speeding train. We run through a lot of pre-printed material at lower levels, and after the third level mark, and thing in that actual range becomes a cake walk. So, the DM has to bump it up a notch, which increases the xp, which so causes a bump again, etc. At 21st level, though, the new bonuses become very limited. While, for example, it was rare for them to stay at the same level for more then two adventures, now they are stuck there for awhile per level. Granted, they all have phenomenal cosmic powers, but so do the bad guys.
A side note, I know a lot of people have issues with epic level play in 3.5. For my group, it works. It slows them down, which is a good thing. They do this thing, and I am guilty of it as well, where we think way outside the box. After third level, it becomes a speeding train. We run through a lot of pre-printed material at lower levels, and after the third level mark, and thing in that actual range becomes a cake walk. So, the DM has to bump it up a notch, which increases the xp, which so causes a bump again, etc. At 21st level, though, the new bonuses become very limited. While, for example, it was rare for them to stay at the same level for more then two adventures, now they are stuck there for awhile per level. Granted, they all have phenomenal cosmic powers, but so do the bad guys.
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