Discworld - Best system?

[Macbeth]

There are 3 classes: Warrior, Adept, and Expert. Warrior does combat (Full BAB, Combat-related feats), Adept has magic (access to magic is done through feats that only Adpets can take), and Expert has skills (more skills known, rogue and bard type feats).

Damage is a lot like Mutants and Mastermins (you make a save against it) but your only bonus to the save is you CON, you armor, and maybe a bonus from a feat or supernatural ability. So high level characters won't have saves that much higher then low level.

All magic is gained through feats. Once you have a spell, it has a rank equal to your Adept level + 3 (like a skill). This rank is used like a skill bonus in some cases and as a DC in others (or just as an indication of what can be done for a few). Each adept chooses a key ability for all their spells. (For Discworld, I'd say wizards have to use INT or CHA, and Witches must use WIS or CHA, but this would be a house rule.)

Any other questions? I'm finding I understand the system better the more I explain it (It's easy to understand no matter what, but now I feel like I know what I can expect my players to ask).

 

[NewLifeForm]

Fascinating...

Wow, thanks Macbeth, that's very helpful. And while I've got you here...

How does money work? Do you buy things with gold (or AM Dollars in this case) or do you have a wealth stat? Is their anyway to differentiate wizards from clerics? Are their any stats for creatures and monsters or do I need to do that myself?

Thanks again, and to everyone for their opinions and for helping out,
NewLifeForm

 

[Macbeth]

Wealth is done with a Wealth Score like d20 Modern. Want to buy something? Roll your wealth against a DC set by the item. Depending on the cost relative to your Wealth, your wealth may go down afetrwards.

The PDF includes stats for:
Bat
Bear
Boar
Cat
Dog
Ghost
Goblin (1st Level Warrior)
Harpy
Hawk
Horse
Ogre
Orc (1st Level Warrior)
Rat
Rat, Dire
Shark
Skeleton
Snake, Constrictor
Snake, Viper
Vampire
Wolf
Zombie

I don't think it would be too hard to come up with standard Discworld beasties based on this bunch. Trolls could be based on Ogres. The Nac Mac Feegle might have something in common with goblins...but smaller... and meaner...

For wizards and clerics... Well, my first thought, given that Discworld clerics have never really displayed much magical apptitude, would be to have Clerics be experts. After all, only the UU wizards seem to really use magic (in the civilized areas). Clerics could really be any class, they just have the role in society of being Clerics. Depending on your view (or the players view) of what the cleric does, I might suggest these feats:

Fascinate, Inspire, Suggest, Mass Suggest, Well Informed: For the public orrator. If you want a cleric that really leads (or perhaps manipulates) people, this would be a good start. Especially the clerics of Om seen in Small Gods.

Begginers Luck, Lucky, Jack of All Trades, Second Chance, Slow Fall, Wild Talent, Talented: If your cleric is the chosen of the Gods, someone that the Lady smiles on. Basically, the lucky SOB.

Eidectic Memory, Talented, Skill Training, Master Plan: For the well trained priest. Could be combined with the orator. For anybody trained by the preisthood.

Favored Opponent, Smite Foe, Spirited Charge, Rage, Great Toughness: For the crusader, D&D style cleric (or Paladin).

You could mix all of these to some degree. Wealth would probably also be good for anyt of them.


If you really want them to have spells, you could have them all take Wild Talent, or they could take levels in Adept with a restricted list of available spells.

Anything else? I'm starting to like this idea, I may have to do a homebrew conversion of my own (and post it here, of course).

 

[NewLifeForm]

Anything else? I'm starting to like this idea, I may have to do a homebrew conversion of my own (and post it here, of course).

Mmm but of course!

Looks like I'm going True20! I'll keep you all posted as to how it goes.

NewLifeForm
"Ook"

 

[Tonguez]

Damn!!!

I've not looked at True20 (or BlueRose) since the nearest FLGS is 3 hours away but after reading Macbeth's info above its starting to sound like the perfect system - for everything! (I'm starting to dribble just thinking about it -eeew)

so what are the flaws?

There are 3 classes: Warrior, Adept, and Expert. Warrior does combat (Full BAB, Combat-related feats), Adept has magic (access to magic is done through feats that only Adpets can take), and Expert has skills (more skills known, rogue and bard type feats).

Damage is a lot like Mutants and Mastermins (you make a save against it) but your only bonus to the save is you CON, you armor, and maybe a bonus from a feat or supernatural ability. So high level characters won't have saves that much higher then low level.

All magic is gained through feats. Once you have a spell, it has a rank equal to your Adept level + 3 (like a skill). This rank is used like a skill bonus in some cases and as a DC in others (or just as an indication of what can be done for a few). Each adept chooses a key ability for all their spells. (For Discworld, I'd say wizards have to use INT or CHA, and Witches must use WIS or CHA, but this would be a house rule.)

Any other questions? I'm finding I understand the system better the more I explain it (It's easy to understand no matter what, but now I feel like I know what I can expect my players to ask).

 

[MoogleEmpMog]

I've not looked at True20 (or BlueRose) since the nearest FLGS is 3 hours away but after reading Macbeth's info above its starting to sound like the perfect system - for everything! (I'm starting to dribble just thinking about it -eeew)

so what are the flaws?

From what I can see, True20 has, at most, three flaws:

1. It's not SilCore.
2. It's not officially point-buy, but it practically is, so no sweat.
3. It doesn't have a huge amount of pregenerated content, such as monsters. No worries here, either, though, because it's almost completely compatible with d20. It's not that hard to give monsters a damage save, after all.

 

[arscott]

Standa alone game... grumble grumble...

I used to be a fan of SJGames. However, I had long ago given up GURPS and had sold all the core rules for GURPS 1st edition, and hadn't bought any of the new GURPS material, because GURPS really wasn't my cup of tea.

I bought GURPS Discworld through the SJGames website for my wife as a present, excited because it claimed to be a stand-alone game. My wife and I were very interested in running an Unseen University mini-campaign with another friend.

And of course, GURPS Discworld / GURPS lite doesn't include the GURPS rules for magic.

Yep - fantasy setting - with magic, wizards, spells, etc... but no rules for magic.

One geek-rific anniversary gift down the tubes, I asked SJGames for a refund, or at least for an excerpt from a book that does describe how magic works in GURPS. I got a 'friendly' response that I would have to (a) buy the core GURPS book to get the rules and no they won't send me the excerpt and (b) suck it up, they don't give refunds and the book -is- a stand-alone RPG since no one actually needs the magic rules to play the game.

I ended up indeed buying two core books of GURPS rules, but never ran the game because of the bad taste left in my mouth from the horrible customer service. To this day, I only buy non-RPG products from SJGames because of this, and get REALLY rilled up whenever I see a release that claims to be "powered by GURPS".

(BTW, the purchases from Warehouse 23 weren't completely wasted, I also picked up two boxes of boosters for one of my fave OOP CCGs, XXXenophile).

Given how often the magicians in Discworld actually cast spells, this seems oddly appropriate.

 

[Jürgen Hubert]

I've not looked at True20 (or BlueRose) since the nearest FLGS is 3 hours away but after reading Macbeth's info above its starting to sound like the perfect system - for everything! (I'm starting to dribble just thinking about it -eeew)

so what are the flaws?

The skill system is a bit weird - you are either untrained at a skill, or you are a master of it (i.e., you have a skill rank of your level + 3). This can be weird for high-level characters, since if they acquire a new skill, they instantly go from incompetence to surpassing everyone else.

I'm also not a fan of abstract wealth systems (in this case, it is pretty much identical to that in d20 Modern), but the standard money system from D&D can be adapted without any hassles...

Apart from that, it is indeed very good.

 

[Macbeth]

The skill system is a bit weird - you are either untrained at a skill, or you are a master of it (i.e., you have a skill rank of your level + 3). This can be weird for high-level characters, since if they acquire a new skill, they instantly go from incompetence to surpassing everyone else.

I'm also not a fan of abstract wealth systems (in this case, it is pretty much identical to that in d20 Modern), but the standard money system from D&D can be adapted without any hassles...

Apart from that, it is indeed very good.

I agree that the skills are more then a bit strange, since you either have them all the way or not at all. ON the other hand, you can spend conviction to pick up a skill for a scene, so that helps cover up the problem to some degree.

There's also a thread around here somewhere describing some alternate ideas for skills, rangin from just adding skill points back in (something I'm not fond of) to making two tiers of skills: known and trained. Basically, double the amount of skills each class has. You can 'spend' one skill to make it known (rank level + 3 / 2) and spend another to make it 'trained' (rank level +3).

But yeah, I'd say the 'all-or-nothing' skills would probably be my biggest problem, especially for a Discoworld game. But I believe there is a feat that allows you to pick up a new skill, so that helps some.

Beyond the skills, I can't think of too many problems. Then again, this product really targets me to large degree (I was a big fan of Mutants and Mastermind and the Psychic's Handbook, two books that show a lot of early ideas that made it into True20).

I'll have to think more about it, but my biggest flaw would have to be skills, followed by a lack of material (monsters and such). I think the print edition will include more everything, which should help.

 

[jmucchiello]

RISUS is perfect for Discworld. RISUS is rules lite (6 pages). It is cliche-based (and all discworld characters are cliches*). It is designed for "lite" as in less-than-serious gaming and I dread to imagine someone playing a dramatic, serious game set on Discworld. It is illustrated with stick figures. Did I mention it's only 6 pages long?

* Okay, some, nay most, discworld characters are actually cliches turned on their heads. But that's okay because that head-turning-on is itself a cliche. So Rincewind becomes "Bumbling, Spell-less Wizard (4), Runs Away, Faster in the Actual Face of Danger (4), Not so snazy dresser (2)." Carrot is "Never Was and Never Will Be King, But He Comports Himself Well (3), Painfully Honest Cop (5), Slowly Learning How Not to Say Stuff (2)." Etc. Maybe I do more of these if I get bored....