Dislike 4E? You can write off 5E

[Piratecat]

I well remember that quote. Laughing about the question implies they are no where near a 4th edition, when the truth was it was damn near at the printer.

If by "being announced in the following year and then hitting the shelves a year after that" is at the printer, then yes.

I'm curious, because you seem angry about something that strikes me as both unsurprising and predictable. Let's say you work for WotC, you've signed a non-disclosure agreement, and someone asks you about something you can't talk about. What do you tell them?

(That's not a trap (cue Admiral Akbar!); I'm seriously curious.)

 

[ggroy]

Let's say you work for WotC, you've signed a non-disclosure agreement, and someone asks you about something you can't talk about. What do you tell them?

Plead the 5th.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pleading_the_Fifth

 

[Dausuul]

I can't point you at a source, I'm going from memory. Every time someone asked about a 4th edition, someone from WOTC always either blew off the question, or flat lied to us. Not that I believe 5e is on the horizon, but I wouldn't trust a WOTC employee if he told me the sun rose in the east.

Of course they blew off the question, what else could they do? Pleading the Fifth is all very well in court, but in a scenario like this it's tantamount to announcing 4E.

I'm going from memory too, and what I remember is a lot of people screaming about lies, but when you tracked down the events where the supposed lies were told, it turned out nobody had said anything of the kind. No one has EVER, to my recollection, produced a valid source for any such claim. Therefore I regard those claims as spurious.

 

[Knightfall]

Total non sequitur. I was around an about during the 2-3 change (it's how I found this site) and while memory is a fickle mistress, I don't recall their still being such a backdraft 20 months into 3E's life cycle.

There was no backdraft because it was time for a new edition. 2e had gone as far as it could go. There was a real threat that D&D would die with TSR. DRAGON Magazine and DUNGEON Magazine were forced into limbo.

WotC swooped in, bought TSR, and saved the game. Everyone assumed that they'd make D&D their own. Sure, some people worried about D&D becoming more like a CCG (including me), but those fears were quickly put to rest when 3e came out. WotC stayed true to the history of the game and built something that seemed extraordinary at the time.

It was new, it was different, yet it was still D&D! Plus, there came the OGL. That was an unexpected twist. It was a wildfire that caught on with the Internet crowd and 3PPs.

Thus, changing from 2e to 3e can hardly be compared to changing from 3e to 4e. (IMO.)

3e wasn't even close to death although it had grown a bit bloated. WotC simply wanted to distance themselves from the OGL. They wanted to regain control over D&D as a brand, and I don't blame them for making that decision.

They had to do it.

4e became about reinvention and it could be said to be revolutionary instead of evolutionary. Canon be damned! It had to change to bring in new gamers.

Our world is not the same as it was even 10 years ago. Technology continues to change our world and has now changed the way RPGs are played and perceived. An online model was a requirement to compete with WoW, XBOX, and the like.

Personally, I will always prefer 3e to 4e. (NOTE: Now, I also prefer BECMI to 1e/2e [rules not fluff].) Still, Dark Sun has brought me into the 4e fold; however, I will never be a 4e fanboy.

I'm too attached to the history of 2e and older editions.

WotC would have to put out Greyhawk (classic version), Mystara (plus Hollow World), Planescape (with the Great Wheel), and Spelljammer as "3 book" campaign settings in order to truly convert me, and if the interview with James Wyatt says anything, it says that those settings aren't likely to be redone (at all or in such a way).

IMO, Dragonlance will likely happen, but I think the next setting will be something completely new. Something revolutionary, perhaps?

Anyway, I'll stop ranting now.

Cheers!

Knightfall

 

[Maggan]

We were told the same thing about 4e up until the day they announced it.

Well, I wasn't told that, so you maybe you should revise that to say "we minus Maggan" or something, since I would rather speak for myself in these matters, and not be lumped into some nebulous "we" category.

Thank you for you consideration in this matter.



/M

 

[Haffrung Helleyes]

At the GenCon 1 year before the one where 4E was announced, I had a brief conversation with a senior WoTC D&D guy , Charles Ryan if I am not mistaken. I asked point blank if 4E was coming out any time soon, and was told that as far as he knew, no one at WoTC was even working on such a thing.

Ken

 

[Umbran]

WotC simply wanted to distance themselves from the OGL. They wanted to regain control over D&D as a brand, and I don't blame them for making that decision.

They had to do it.

I understand that you don't actually think this was something to hold against them, but please, you're claiming to know their motives when, as far as I am aware, they've never said anything of the sort.

I'm not at all convinced they'd "lost control" of the brand, that they needed this to regain it.

 

[Knightfall]

I understand that you don't actually think this was something to hold against them, but please, you're claiming to know their motives when, as far as I am aware, they've never said anything of the sort.

I'm not at all convinced they'd "lost control" of the brand, that they needed this to regain it.

Sorry about that... the "In My Opinion" was implied. I was ranting and got carried away.

I realize I don't know WotC/Hasbro's true motives, but I have my suspicions. The truth is that none of us can know the "true" reason for why "4e stepped away from D&D canon" unless they tell us, and they aren't likely to do that anytime soon (or at all).

It would be "fuel on the fire," which would be bad for business.

 

[DaveMage]

WotC already fired every key designer responsible for the earliest stages of 4E except Wyatt and Collins. Who know the clock is ticking. And of course anyone working so closely on 4E would say that 5E couldn't possibly depart from their brainchild, the emblem of perfection.

Don't forget Mearls - he's still there.

He was hired in 2005 - the same time work on 4E picked up.

(Frankly, I think this is what killed 3pps more than anything - the guy had written like, a billion 3pp products. Suddenly there was a vacuum! )

 

[carmachu]

why are thewy even discussing 5th edition? Its what, year 2 of 4e? Its silly to even discuss it as a designer.