DMG Excerpt: Customizing Monsters

[Guild Goodknife]

Ok.

-> Gamist rules which are completely unlogical

Magic Threashold makes no sense. Why do high level monsters not benefit from magical weapons? One explanation is that their magical "monsterousness" overpowers the magical attributes of the weapon. That works for monsters but it is very likely that NPCs will be build with the same system and I can't think a reason why a human level 20 NPC can't benefit from a +2 Weapon.
It solves that PCs get piles of magical weapons but in a very clunky way.

Yeah it's a gamist solution, but nothing prevents you from ignoring the magic treshold table if you dislike it. I actually like this way better because now monster don't *need* magic items to challenge the PCs. In 3.X you often had to provide them with magic stuff to bridge the gap.
But if you really dislike the magic treshold just don't use it. Granted, the math gets messed up a bit, but encounter design has always been more of an art than an exact science.

->Fluff text and game rules mismatch

Vampire lords create armies of vampire spawns......how? Certainly not through their blood drain ability.

Maybe that is stated in the detailed Monster Manual entry? Remember, the templates are designed as a quick way to modify a creature.

And I fail to see how the Lich template is in any way geared for arcane casters considering that a fighter with a /encounter ability also benefits from it (but that is more of a case of the Lich being bland instead of flavor text mismatch)

Oh my god...i'd never thought i'd say this but... Derren has a valid point! The lich template sure seems a bit broad.
Edit: I just checked the old 3.5 Lich template in the SRD and, well, looking back it doesn't appear to be specifically geared for arcane caster either.

 

[vagabundo]

So templates no longer change creatures radically, just make them tougher? That's disappointing. My favorite third party book was Advanced Bestiary by Green Ronin; it contains a few dozen Very Cool templates which did all sorts of things. The Shadow Creature template from Lords of Madness has been used a lot in my games, as well.

No more shadow bandits, half-plant wolves, or elder eidolon ogres, it seems... (all of which have featured in my campaign). I suppose the logic is that monster creation is now so easy that making same-level or slightly-stronger monsters is best done from scratch.

<Shudder> Never have liked messing with templates (after creating a whole forest full of fiendish critters that could be summoned) so I dont get your love.

Still I can imagine someone is working on ideas for a book of more involved templates now that the licensing issues have been (hopefully) sorted.

Does the Aura Of Badassitude (tm) apply to PCs? If a 15th level PC uses a +1 sword, does he get no benefit
from it?

I'd guess the monster math (mash??) is different from the PC math, so the PC would get the the benefit.

Regeneration -- so there's no more tracking different damage types. This means that if you keep hitting the lich with radiant damage -- even a smidgen -- you will kill it via normal damage, but if it can acoid it for a turn, it begins regenerating. I can see this; it makes a sort of sense. Keep hitting something with what its vulnerable to and its weaker overall, but if it gets away from that damage source, its powers come back. A lot like Kryptonite.

As I had earlier worried, the lack of any breakdown of natural vs. artificial armor bonus means Armor Is Wonky.

I like the regeneration and the natural armour doesn't stack. It does seem a little fiddly: having to work backwards (to get the armour modifier) then forwards with the new armour modifier, but the streamlining on the whole system makes up for it. I can take wonky in small doses.

The lich's spellmaster ability doesn't seem limited to 'magical' encounter powers. I like the necrotic ability. Poor Xykon, though, will mourn the loss of his paralyzing touch.

I think this is where the system will shine. Just grab a paralysing power from another monster entry that you like and replace or add to the lich template. Bingo, all liches in my campaign have paralysing touch.

If you add a template to an already elite monster, does it become a solo? What happens if you add one to a solo? Does it raise its level? (They mention beholder liches, and beholders are solo monsters)

Didnt it mention about double templating? standard+template=eilte, (elite+template)xdouble hp=solo.

I guess a Solo+template = higher level using the reality check.

I like that "reality check" is all part of the system. I'm hoping for more in the DMG on this with guidelines and tables so outliers can be spotted and fixed (or left as an achillies heel/mutation)...

 

[Gargazon]

One think I'm not sure about there is the concern your elite monsters, when templated to solo, won't have enough hp... let's see, you're ADDING another normal monster's worth of hp and THEN doubling? So it has the hp of... six monsters, surely?

Also, cause I wanna:

Grell Philosalich(excuse the name) Level 11 Solo Controller
Medium aberrant magical beast (undead) XP 30000 (I think)
Necromantic Aura (Necrotic) aura 5
Any living creature that starts its turn in the aura takes 5 necrotic damage
Initiative +10 Senses Perception +12, blindsight 12, darkvision
HP 656 Bloodied 328
AC 29, Fort 25, Ref 24, Will 27
Immune Disease, Poison Resist 20 Lightning, 10 Necrotic
Saving Throws +5
Speed 1 (clumsy), fly 6 (hover)
Action Points 2
Regeneration 10; if the Grell Philosalich takes radiant damage, its regeneration does not function next turn.
m Tentacle Rake (standard; at-will) - Poison (or Necrotic)
Reach 2; +17 vs AC; 3d8 +5 damage (or Necrotic damage), and the target is slowed and takes a -2 penalty to attack rolls (save ends)
r Lightning Lance (standard; at-will) - Lightning (or Necrotic)
Range 10; +14 vs Reflex; 3d6 +6 lightning damage (or Necrotic damage), and the target is blinded.
a Psychic Storm (standard; recharge 6) - Psychic (or Necrotic), Zone
Area Burst 2 within 10; +14 vs Will; 3d8 +3 Psychic damage (or Necrotic damage) and the target is dazed (save ends). The Psychic Storm is a zone effect and lasts until the end of the encounter. Any creature entering the zone is dazed (save ends).
c Venomous Mind (standard; at-will) - Psychic (or, surprisingly, Necrotic)
Close Burst 3; targets enemies; +15 vs Will; 2d8 +5 Psychic damage (or Necrotic damage), and the target must choose a random target for any melee attacks he makes (save ends).
Alignment Evil Lanaguages Deep Speech
Skills Arcana +13, Stealth +20
Str 14 (+7) Dex 21 (+10) Wis 14 (+7)
Con 16 (+8) Int 16 (+8) Cha 13 (+6)

I missed out the things I didn't need, and the hardest part about adding that was.... um... actually, it was bloody easy

 

[Khaalis]

-> Gamist rules which are completely unlogical

Magic Threashold makes no sense. Why do high level monsters not benefit from magical weapons? One explanation is that their magical "monsterousness" overpowers the magical attributes of the weapon. That works for monsters but it is very likely that NPCs will be build with the same system and I can't think a reason why a human level 20 NPC can't benefit from a +2 Weapon.
It solves that PCs get piles of magical weapons but in a very clunky way.

Actually I think its a rather elegant solution. They have basically applied the "no magic" modifications to monsters. A monster does not "NEED" to carry a +X Weapon to hit a PC of the appropriate level. This bonus is already an "assumed" mechanic in the construction of the creature and thus the creature is balanced at its base stats. If you then start heaping additional bonuses on top of its core math, you break the balance and quickly outstrip the PC's ability to compete. Also this applies to NPCs as well. NPCs are no longer built as a PC. An "enemy" Fighter is no longer built as a PC fighter but as either a monster Brute or Soldier.
If a 6th level Soldier is assumed to already have the equivalent of a +1 bonus to attacks and damage built into its core math, then adding another +1 to attack and damage by giving them "full bonus" from a +1 weapon throws off their balance. Too many people seem to not understand just how quickly magic item bonuses can break the balance of an encounter.

->Fluff text and game rules mismatch

Vampire lords create armies of vampire spawns......how? Certainly not through their blood drain ability.
And I fail to see how the Lich template is in any way geared for arcane casters considering that a fighter with a /encounter ability also benefits from it (but that is more of a case of the Lich being bland instead of flavor text mismatch)

This I have to basically agree with. I have to assume that this Preview is not entirely completely verbatim from the book. I would assume that the Vampire also has text for describing how a vampire makes Vampire Spawn or passes their power to a mortal to be a vampire lord. As for the lich, here too I think there is text not included in the preview. For instance Spellmaster seems like it would be geared toward refreshing arcane powers. However, the template does specifically state that it can be applied to any creature that meets the prerequisites. Also note that the most important tie to making the lich most associated to the arcane is the reliance on rituals. Its not clear, I'll give you that. But then again, templates are meant for DMs to apply to monsters and not necessarily to make perfect sense whan applied to the thinking associated with PCs.

 

[charlesatan]

Oh my god...i'd never thought i'd say this but... Derren has a valid point! The lich template sure seems a bit broad.

True but I think there are other optimal template choices if the creature isn't either an Artillery or a Controller. Like a Brute-type template I would presume would give more hp per level and perhaps a tougher defense. Sure, there are some abilities from the Lich that are lucrative but I expect there are better, more flavor-suiting abilities from the other templates for the various roles.

 

[med stud]

This I have to basically agree with. I have to assume that this Preview is not entirely completely verbatim from the book. I would assume that the Vampire also has text for describing how a vampire makes Vampire Spawn or passes their power to a mortal to be a vampire lord. As for the lich, here too I think there is text not included in the preview. For instance Spellmaster seems like it would be geared toward refreshing arcane powers. However, the template does specifically state that it can be applied to any creature that meets the prerequisites. Also note that the most important tie to making the lich most associated to the arcane is the reliance on rituals. Its not clear, I'll give you that. But then again, templates are meant for DMs to apply to monsters and not necessarily to make perfect sense whan applied to the thinking associated with PCs.

Do we really need rules for how a vampire lord creates vampire spawn? Sure, that they can do it is important to know, but hard rules? I can't see what it adds to the game to know that a vampire lord can create level/2 vampire spawns per night by using it's ability Create Vampire Spawn [ritual].

Since the vampire lord is a NPC, the DM can add the desired number of vampire spawns without having to trudge through rules to do it. I'm probably a minority in thinking this, so there most likely is an ability for it, but I can't see the need for rules for something like that.

 

[Ulthwithian]

On the Vampire Lord Thrall subject... I'll point out that the Lich creates his phylactery using a ritual. I would not be surprised in the least if there were a ritual that could be performed to lengthen the duration of a 'dominate' effect.

 

[Jon Wake]

Or instead of a mismatch between fluff and crunch (my soul died a little saying that) they leave large portions of it to the DM. If you want vampires to create spawn only through a blood ritual, you can do it that way. Or you can do it where anyone who dies of a vampires bite becomes a spawn. You can set the time to a day later, a minute later, or a week later. Its your game.

 

[vagabundo]

Oh my god...i'd never thought i'd say this but... Derren has a valid point! The lich template sure seems a bit broad.
Edit: I just checked the old 3.5 Lich template in the SRD and, well, looking back it doesn't appear to be specifically geared for arcane caster either.

It does seem to be designed that way:

It best complements an arcane NPC, such as a wizard or warlock, or a monster with arcane powers, such as a beholder or oni.

Since the DM is applying the template, why tell the DM what class/NPCs to apply it too. They will do what they want anyway. I think it the prerequisites are there a guide to what it suits. (Still why limit the vampire lord to humanoid creatures then?). hmm.

 

[eleran]

Why do vampire lords resist 5 necrotic at 1st level and 10 at 11th level? They have a prerequisite of 11th level.

In case you want to rule 0 it and make a vampire like Claudia from Interview with the Vampire.