D&D 5E Does anyone else feel like the action economy and the way actions work in general in 5e both just suck?

[Zio_the_dark]

i started playing 5e a few months ago. It angered me day one. The irritation has been building.

Then perhaps you should just play another system and see how it goes for you??

 

[Oofta]

No game is going to work for everyone. The system obviously works for a lot of people.

 

[Davinshe]

There are logical inconsistancies in the classifications of actions and scenarios in which one is faster than another.

Further, its implied that there are actions that require different amounts of time but reside within the same action length class. Example: non cantrip spells of 1 action time length and cantrip spells of 1 action time length. They actually take different amounts of time, which is what makes it possible to cast one (cantrips) twice on your turn and the other (non cantrip spell) only once plus a cantrip. Is there a classification for an action that is short enough it could occur in tge difference of time between the two clearly different time length standards of 1 standard action? There should be a classified brief time length for that but there doesnt directoy seem to be. If not, sloppy. If there is one though, also sloppy. Why? Because if there is then there should have been a differentiation between what is functionally two different action types that got lumped into "standard action". But there isnt.

From an objective point of view there are functionally two different action types (or lengths) that are lazily never differentiated and are lumped under the same umbrella.

There is an example. There are others. But just look at that one first. Its sloppy.

This was the standout issue that came to my mind about the action economy. I understand it's a balance issue, but it's so weird and jarring when you learn about it because it breaks with the system in such an unexpected way. Other than that, I think players sometimes wish they had the option of action "downgrading" that 4th edition had, where you could trade a greater action for a lesser. I know my players would sometimes like to take an extra bonus action in exchange for not moving, but I'm not sad that rule is gone. What is it that people want out of the action economy that they don't have? 3rd edition style full round actions? that just sucks motion and movement out of combat for little real gain. I guess I don't see the real issue.

 

[Zio_the_dark]

No game is going to work for everyone. The system obviously works for a lot of people.

I'm not too much in 5th edition myself but as many people i like and dislike parts of it. As a gm (i play only with long time friends so no problem here) I often use house rules to offset what I dislike and always ask my players if they feel the new rule is worth the hassle or not...

 

[Son of the Serpent]

Then perhaps you should just play another sustem and see how it goes for you??

Im trying to adjust to 5e in case 6e doesnt improve on its horrible game design. Look im not trying to start an edition war but its very hard to be positive about this thing. I feel like a lot of people handle it with kid gloves. The gloves need to come off to try to improve things. And i think the actions are design far more poorly than a lot of people are comfortable admitting.

Perhaps its because the head designer was a bit of an airhead. I dont know. Maybe he hired one. But there are a lot about the actions i find needlessly clips wings or is self contradicting.

I also think you can look at quotes by the designers and see sometimes they werent really thinking straight when they decided how restrictive to make the rules because even now that the rules are published they still say a lot of contradicting things.

From jeremy crawford himself. You can use a bonus action to put on full plate heavy armor. You cannot use a bonus action to chug a potion.

Wat?

If this is the kind if logic going into 6e evebtually then there are two options. 1 just lie back and take it. 2 figure out how to fix it with homebrew that is simple and popular enough to influence next gen ideas due to how many people are using it. Doesnt even have to be that widely used for that ti happen. It just needs to be seen by wotc as possibly catchy and more reward than work.

I'm not too much in 5th edition myself but as many people i like and dislike parts of it. As a gm (i play only with long time friends so no problem here) I often use house rules to offset what I dislike and always ask my players if they feel the new rule is worth the hassle or not...

Do you have any actions-related houserules? I'd be interested in hearing them.

 

[atanakar]

Yet, another discontent thread about how a portion of the rules in 5e work. This is getting old. Play another version of D&D or another RPG that does what you want.

BTW 6e is not going to happen any time soon the way sales keep going up.

 

[JeffB]

There are plenty of great games out there, life's too short to get angry about game rules. I may "argue" til the wee hours of the morning here about game rules and my preferences, but I don't get angry or lose sleep over a make believe game of faeries and dragons.

5E is not my main game or my personal favorite iteration of the game but we still have fun playing it when we do I get my D&D fix mainly through 13th Age and O/TSR games, but I'd rather play Dungeon World than any of those. My players are not always up to the investment DW takes though (and some days, neither am I)

 

[JeffB]

Yet, another discontent thread about how a portion of the rules in 5e work. This is getting old.

Welcome to the internet.

I've been here since before Russ bought(?) the site from Eric. You better get used to it. 95% of the conversation here is about XYZ sucks about Edition ABC. Likewise with the majority of other message boards.

 

[Tales and Chronicles]

So the game is bad because action are calculated in in-game seconds? wow.

People alrealdy have a hard time figuring out how to maximize their action economy and you want to add things like '' you turn is 45 second, this cantrip use 6 second, this full spell use 21 seconds and each 5 ft of move use 2 seconds. Now what do you do on your turn? '' What a mess it would be

You can use a bonus action to put on full plate heavy armor

uhhhh no? It takes like 10 minutes to don a heavy armor.

Is it me or most of your posts on 5e from the last few months have been how this game sucks? Maybe its just a a bad fit, because what you seem to want out of the game is totally the opposite of what 5e propose now and will propose in the future.

I'm on the team that would like an even simpler 6th edition, but when I get tired of 5e (which is often) I play more basic games, such as tiny dungeon or the black hack. You may prefer a game that is built for the level of crunch you'd like.

 

[Davinshe]

Oh man, after the flame wars of 4th edition, very little bugs me. Those were really dark times for the community. Trust me, it could be worse.