D&D (2024) Does anyone else think that 1D&D will create a significant divide in the community?

[Micah Sweet]

I'm not saying it will but that it could. Part of me thinks that the changes we are seeing will be scaled back due to negative feedback and not be as many big proposed changes that we have seen so far in the playtest material.

But if the level of changes (or something close) that we are seeing go through, the game will be changed quite a bit. It will still have the same basic structure/mechanics but there will be limits to how much mixing and matching can happen between 5e and 1D&D.
Currently you can't use the more powerful Races from 5e (which provide Ability increases) with the Backgrounds from character origins playtest (which provide Ability Increases and a feat) and pick a Class from 5e with a subclass from 1 D&D (or vice versa) that have a different number of subclass features at different levels. And yes they cover the ability score increase in a sidebar and can make conversion rules for other things. But freely mixing and matching will through off the balance of things.

But with the amount of changes we are seeing (if a similar amount make it into the final product) I know there will be groups that don't change to the new rules and am sure there will be groups that will abandon all the old rules and just stick to just the new. Other groups may use a houseruled mix of the 2.

It is possible this with will create a divide in the community where some people are not buying the new material that is being produced by WotC and maybe even being supported by some 3rd party publishers that stick with 5e.

So while there is certain to be a divide, how significant do you currently think it will be? It might only be a small number of groups that don't convert to the new rules and stop buying any new books from WotC. Just like with every edition change some groups will remain with the edition they are used to/like. But will the size of this 5e only community be significant? Could the divide be big enough that 1D&D actually, ironically, creates a need to make a new 6e to reunite the community? (Probably not?)

And with the changes you have seen so far, if they all pretty much make it into the finished 1D&D release, would you and your group change to the new version? What are your thoughts so far about this?

Well, I can't speak for the community, but I am not buying any more of WotC's products, and turned to 3pp a little while back. I'm mostly following 6e's development to see if they come up with any ideas I might want to incorporate into our home game.

 

[MNblockhead]

Not a significant split. I think the number of people who reject the new core books will not be much more significant than the number of people who stick with even older versions, switch to OSR games, or tire of D&D and move to a different system entirely. For me, a "significant" split would mean something like what happened with 4e and the rise of Pathfinder.

I also don't think that D&D will hit a "recession" in the next 2-3 years. I think that even if the movie and TV show do not delight hard-core fans they are likely going to be popular enough--in addition to the success of the Vox Machina cartoon, continued popularity of live-stream games, and greater coverage in the media--to bring in a greater number of new fans than those who leave.

 

[billd91]

I think it all depends on just how much of a departure 1D&D is from 5e. If it's compatible to the point where the PCs are pretty much interchangeable from edition to edition, the split will be minor - probably limited to people allowing the change to get their noses out of joint over stuff that's relatively marginal.
This isn't a major structural shift like 4e, it isn't coming ridiculously soon like 3.5 on the heels of 3.0, it isn't about snubbing Gygax like some people used as a reason to hate 2e. By the time 1D&D is out, 5e will be 10 years old and reasonably due a bit of a remodel to improve aspects of the game that didn't work as well as intended in 5e. Signs are that it won't be a terribly big departure in the way it works so far. So I'm optimistic that there won't be a significant split in the community.

 

[payn]

And neither have come close to what pathfinder 1e did to dnd 4e. They're still a very minor chunk of the market next to dnd 5e.

Actually, Paizo says PF2 is doing better than PF1 if you can believe that. All kinds of indie and D&D alternatives are doing very well right now. Of course, they pale in comparison to D&D and always have, but they are seeing a lot of desire for products. What it tells me is that a lot of folks playing 5E are likely also playing other games in addition to, as opposed to instead of.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I think it all depends on just how much of a departure 1D&D is from 5e. If it's compatible to the point where the PCs are pretty much interchangeable from edition to edition, the split will be minor - probably limited to people allowing the change to get their noses out of joint over stuff that's relatively marginal.
This isn't a major structural shift like 4e, it isn't coming ridiculously soon like 3.5 on the heels of 3.0, it isn't about snubbing Gygax like some people used as a reason to hate 2e. By the time 1D&D is out, 5e will be 10 years old and reasonably due a bit of a remodel to improve aspects of the game that didn't work as well as intended in 5e. Signs are that it won't be a terribly big departure in the way it works so far. So I'm optimistic that there won't be a significant split in the community.

For my part, I'm just not going to spend $200 on a new set of corebooks for a game that isn't significantly better than what I'm playing now. So far, it isn't, and I don't expect it to become so in a year and half, as the design goals of WotC have little to do with what I want from a RPG.

 

[eyeheartawk]

Actually, Paizo says PF2 is doing better than PF1 if you can believe that.

I like PF2 but from my, admittedly, anecdotal observations I have a hard time believing that.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Actually, Paizo says PF2 is doing better than PF1 if you can believe that. All kinds of indie and D&D alternatives are doing very well right now. Of course, they pale in comparison to D&D and always have, but they are seeing a lot of desire for products. What it tells me is that a lot of folks playing 5E are likely also playing other games in addition to, as opposed to instead of.

I would be very curious about the experience of someone playing two different D&D "family" games simultaneously.

 

[payn]

I like PF2 but from my, admittedly, anecdotal observations I have a hard time believing that.

As a huge PF1 guy that did not transfer to PF2, I as well. Though the thing with Paizo has always been the AP subscription line. If that remains strong I guess then I can believe it. Though, I still think my point stands, games dont have to significantly impact 5E to prove they are popular.

 

[payn]

I would be very curious about the experience of someone playing two different D&D "family" games simultaneously.

I played 5E and PF1 at the same time. I also played OSR games like DCC at the same time. What would you like to know?

 

[eyeheartawk]

As a huge PF1 guy that did not transfer to PF2, I as well. Though the thing with Paizo has always been the AP subscription line. If that remains strong I guess then I can believe it. Though, I still think my point stands, games dont have to significantly impact 5E to prove they are popular.

I agree with all of that. Like, DCC has been a huge success, but when weighed relatively against D&D 5e? It seems insignificant.

As for PF2 I'm inclined to think that if PF2 was doing as well as they claim we wouldn't be seeing 5e conversions of adventure paths.