does anyone think sunder is too easy?

[Geoff Watson]

Isn't the usual exchange rate 1:5?

-Hyp.

It costs a Feat as well as the XP.

Geoff.

 

[S'mon]

yes way too easy.

Sunder is only 'too easy' if you have a +5 weapon, or (as GM) are using metagame knowledge as to what '+' an opponent's weapon has. Sunder is a risky tactic if you don't know whether your enemy's weapon has a bigger '+'!
Few of my NPCs will use Sunder as a default option because they don't know whether it can work - it's more likely an act of desperation.
As for PC fighters using it, against weak opponents they won't bother. Against strong ones, it might well not work (the PCs in my game don't have vastly more magic than the NPCs) so if they want to have a go, good on them.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Few of my NPCs will use Sunder as a default option because they don't know whether it can work - it's more likely an act of desperation.

That's what GMW's for

-Hyp.

 

[S'mon]

That's what GMW's for

-Hyp.

Exactly - works for NPCs just as well as PCs.

Don't tell me your NPCS never cast buff spells?!

EG: IMC the PCs can GMW up to +3. There are NPCs who can GMW up to +5, and will do if the PCs don't get the drop on them!

 

[Hypersmurf]

Exactly - works for NPCs just as well as PCs.

That's my point.

You said NPCs don't bother trying to Sunder because it might not work - if they're GMW'd up to +5, that uncertainty is gone...

-Hyp.

 

[S'mon]

That's my point.

You said NPCs don't bother trying to Sunder because it might not work - if they're GMW'd up to +5, that uncertainty is gone...

-Hyp.

OK, for the 99% of NPCs who don't have a 15th level cleric to GMW them, there's uncertainty. The other 1% are mean dudes!
Actually, I'm finding this conversation quite helpful in working out tactics for the mean dude NPCs in my game tomorrow... heh heh heh...

 

[Hypersmurf]

It's non-core, but a DM has license to expand the Brew Potion rules...

Oil of GMW +5 - smear on a weapon or pour on a bunch of arrows for 15 hours of +5 enhancement - would tip the scales at 2250gp an application. Perfect for the Sunder-focussed NPC fighter when you don't want to give out permanent +5 swords... and the PCs get to pick up the two or three doses he keeps on hand as loot afterwards...

-Hyp.

 

[Hypersmurf]

The alternative, of course, is Shatterspike, the sundering longsword from Sword and Fist.

-Hyp.

 

[S'mon]

Mending will fix the item. It will not fix the enchantment. IOW, your 100,000+ gp Holy Avenger is now a MW Longsword.

I'd think it'd be a MW longsword with a material component value of 50,000 gp - ie you could recreate it without having to spend more cash. Although saying it's only a 25000gp MW longsword (so you have to spend 25000) would be reasonable also.

Magic items seem extremely easy to make in 3e, anyway, so I don't see the problem. An unbreakable sword is an Artifact. If sundering helps reduce the prevalence of magic weapons, it sounds like a good thing to me. Just because losing your 100,000 sword is no fun for the PC, doesn't mean it's no fun for the GM.

 

[Hypersmurf]

I'd think it'd be a MW longsword with a material component value of 50,000 gp - ie you could recreate it without having to spend more cash. Although saying it's only a 25000gp MW longsword (so you have to spend 25000) would be reasonable also.

Strictly speaking, it's a MW longsword that happens to be a broken Holy Avenger. The "component value" you mention couldn't be applied to crafting a +1 longsword of Speed out of it, for example.

A Holy Avenger normally costs 60,000gp and 4,800xp to craft. You could restore this one for 30,000gp and 2,400xp.

-Hyp.