Does being raised affect a wizard's spell aquisition?

[TheGogmagog]

So......what about those spells you may have found/bought/stolen and then scribed into your spellbook during that level....the level that you lost during the raise dead? With your interpretation you would lose those too, right?

If you lose acess to a level of spells, you would lose knowlege of the spells of that level. The lower level spell will be safe. If you made the check to learn the spells you have found/bought/stolen you should have a good chance to re-learn them. The DC to re-learn them is something like 15+spell level.

You can take 10 to learn the spell, so it should only be an issue if you don't have 8 hours to make the check. If you don't have ranks in spellcraft you could be out of luck since it's not usable untrained.

 

[Nail]

If you made the check to learn the spells you have found/bought/stolen you should have a good chance to re-learn them.

True enough.

I'm just not convinced the Wiz would need to re-learn lower level spells he may have chosen with his 2 free spells per level.

 

[TheGogmagog]

Sorry, I must have cut that out in one of my re-writes. The lower level spells would be safe.

I don't think that there is any real SRD text to support that you lose the knowlege either, it just seemed wrong to have a learned spell that you can't cast.

I agree; the PC should get the new spells.

Well, he should by RAW. My personal opinion is he shouldn't by DM fiat.
It's not an issue in my campaigns because I handle permanent level loss in the same way Negative Levels are handled, until the character has gained enough exp to be restore the negative levels. That removes all the issues about what HP you rolled, where your skill points were spent and then selecting different spells feats or classes when restored.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/naturalSpecialAbilities.htm#energyDrainAndNegativeLevels
A creature takes the following penalties for each negative level it has gained:
-1 on all skill checks and ability checks.
-1 on attack rolls and saving throws.
-5 hit points.
-1 effective level (whenever the creature’s level is used in a die roll or calculation).
If the victim casts spells, she loses access to one spell as if she had cast her highest-level, currently available spell. (If she has more than one spell at her highest level, she chooses which she loses.) In addition, when she next prepares spells or regains spell slots, she gets one less spell slot at her highest spell level.

 

[Dracomeander]

So......what about those spells you may have found/bought/stolen and then scribed into your spellbook during that level....the level that you lost during the raise dead? With your interpretation you would lose those too, right?

Only if the level loss results in loosing access to the level of spells in question. That applies to the spells researched for free as well. If you don't lose access to the spell level, then you still know the spells. They are assumed to have been added to your book by the normal means of finding and deciphering them. Instead of paying money for the cost of scribing them into his book, the mage ended up paying experience.

Also, the spells are still in the book not completely lost. The mage just has to go through the process of deciphering them again. Note the spells are already in his personal script. The mage does not need to scribe them again, just decipher them.

This is regarding permanent level loss only. Remember, the original question was how to handle what happened when the mage died and was raised resulting in a permanent level loss.

 

[Nail]

Also, the spells are still in the book not completely lost. The mage just has to go through the process of deciphering them again. Note the spells are already in his personal script. The mage does not need to scribe them again, just decipher them.

If they are in his personal script, he doesn't need to decipher the spell:

"......each character uses the system in her own way. Another person’s magical writing remains incomprehensible ...."

You'll note that here, as well as everywhere else in the RAW, the distinction is between the wizard's own writing and that of everyone else.

You may also note that a wizard is not barred from learning and scribing a spell of a higher spell level than he can normally cast.

The spells the wizard scribed into his book before being level-drained are still in his own script, and still known by him. He just may not be able to cast them.

 

[Thanee]

When he levels back up to 9th, do I again get to pick two spells of levels 5 or below, or am I already considered to have aquired them?

Yes, of course you get two new spells, you have been through the whole leveling process once more. The spell knowledge from the level you lost, is not lost, since it is written down in your spellbook. The two free spells each level represent the time spent on spell research during the last level. The wizard has more time for spell research, since he is going through 8th level all over again, so he gets two new spells.

Seems a bit much to be able to get two new spells all over again. Thanks!

As if losing a level wasn't pain enough.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Lord Pendragon]

I consider the spells gained to be the result of work and research during the process of gaining the level, so I'd allow him gain two new ones when he reaches 9th again.

This is my reasoning and ruling as well.

 

[Krelios]

No, the RAW says "each NEW level." Your wizard has been 9th level before, this is not new. You don't get a bonus for dying, sorry. No other class gets to keep the benefit from a lost level and get it again; why should wizards?

Next a fighter will be asking to keep his bonus feat and then get an additional one when he levels again... :\

 

[Tiberius]

No, the RAW says "each NEW level." Your wizard has been 9th level before, this is not new. You don't get a bonus for dying, sorry. No other class gets to keep the benefit from a lost level and get it again; why should wizards?

Next a fighter will be asking to keep his bonus feat and then get an additional one when he levels again... :\

That's the reasoning I was running with originally, but couldn't find rules to support it. The problem with the "fighters don't keep the bonus feat" line of reasoning, though, is that it's not directly applicable. Fighter feats aren't inscribed in a tome somewhere for future reference, whereas the spells are. As such, it's difficult to lose just those two spells and keep the others, while it's easy to just erase "Improved Critical" or some such from the character sheet.

Thanks, everyone, for your help in this. Very interesting points.

 

[Nail]

You don't get a bonus for dying, sorry.

Getting 2 new spells scribed in your spellbook after you've reached 9th level (again) isn't much of a bonus, kid.