Does performing Trip attempts every round ruin Suspension of Disbelief?

[Delta]

However, I'd just like to turn it around for the purpose of this discussion. Is a fighter who, on every round of a combat, is able to Trip someone (with a high degree of success) just as worthy of breaking your Suspension of Disbelief?

No. I agree with Pawsplay -- a fighter with a specialized attack in real life is most likely to use it over and over as long as it's working. It's up to the opponent to actively come up with a counter, if any.

Admittedly if you're doing comic-book or movie-style fighting, then you're likely to see a special attack only 1-3 times within a given story. But that isn't a "suspension of disbelief" issue, that's an "I like my fights cinematic" issue, if you so prefer. Personally I do prefer my D&D games without this particular added barrier to suspension of disbelief.

 

[hong]

I see we're back to the vague one-liners. Taking an enemy to 0 does not equate to flipping or tossing him on the ground. There are rules for when someone is taken to the ground... it's called being prone. How can you inflict this condition on an opponent or even a new adversary more than once if you can only use it 1x per day or 1x per encounter?

If you take someone to 0 hp, they are defeated. You can narrate that any way you wish, as long as it ends with them crumpled in a heap on the ground. That includes ways that nominally involve a "trip". Is this clear?

 

[Imaro]

If you take someone to 0 hp, they are defeated. You can narrate that any way you wish, as long as it ends with them crumpled in a heap on the ground. That includes ways that nominally involve a "trip". Is this clear?

Nice way to avoid my question. Let me try and make this clearer...Again, how do I run a fight where my character, for 6+ rounds of combat is using a style where he takes characters to the ground, if he can only use it once a day? What if he used it in a previous combat? I am not talking about the narration of the last round, I am talking about the narration and rules of the whole fight.

 

[hong]

Nice way to avoid my question.

I am not avoiding your question. You are avoiding the answer.

Let me try and make this clearer...Again, how do I run a fight where my character, for 6+ rounds of combat is using a style where he takes characters to the ground, if he can only use it once a day? What if he used it in a previous combat? I am not talking about the narration of the last round, I am talking about the narration and rules of the whole fight.

By defeating one bad guy per round for 6+ rounds. Yes, Virginia, you do not need a specific "I trip you" power to trip 6 bad guys in a row.

 

[mmadsen]

That's what going to 0 hp does to a guy.

I like the notion of abstract victory, where bringing a guy down to 0 hit points mean you can perform whatever finishing move you like -- but it doesn't really fit into a system where everything else isn't equally abstract.

"I'd like to trip him."
"You've already used your trip power."
"OK, I'll swing my sword instead. Woo-hoo! I hit and did a lot of damage!"
"Ah, you successfully tripped him!"
"Um, cool. I guess."

 

[hong]

I like the notion of abstract victory, where bringing a guy down to 0 hit points mean you can perform whatever finishing move you like -- but it doesn't really fit into a system where everything else isn't equally abstract.

"I'd like to trip him."
"You've already used your trip power."
"OK, I'll swing my sword instead. Woo-hoo! I hit and did a lot of damage!"
"Ah, you successfully tripped him!"
"Um, cool. I guess."

It fits in perfectly well, seeing as how I was using it with a Bo9S-heavy game a year before 4E came out.

 

[mmadsen]

It fits in perfectly well, seeing as how I was using it with a Bo9S-heavy game a year before 4E came out.

Your superior powers of assertion have dropped me to 0 hit points.

I don't think this scenario works for most people here, because it mixes abstract and concrete in a jarring way:

"I'd like to trip him."
"You've already used your trip power."
"OK, I'll swing my sword instead. Woo-hoo! I hit and did a lot of damage!"
"Ah, you successfully tripped him!"
"Um, cool. I guess."​

 

[Imaro]

I am not avoiding your question. You are avoiding the answer.



By defeating one bad guy per round for 6+ rounds. Yes, Virginia, you do not need a specific "I trip you" power to trip 6 bad guys in a row.

So in very specific circumstances, it is possible with DM permission to fake the character I want to play because mechanically I can't back him up...ok. This is, even for you, really stretching it hong...it presupposes you will defeat an opponent each round (which with 4e's game design is nearly impossible). You win hong, your logical answers, instead of vague comebacks wins teh internet.

Back on topic: I still haven't seen evidence that using numerous trips per 3.x breaks any type of verisimilitude (actually it seems the opposite). IMHO, it seems people have a bigger problem with 3.x's rules for it than anything and that isn't really what the OP was asking about.

 

[hong]

Your superior powers of assertion have dropped me to 0 hit points.

I don't think this scenario works for most people here, because it mixes abstract and concrete in a jarring way:

"I'd like to trip him."
"You've already used your trip power."
"OK, I'll swing my sword instead. Woo-hoo! I hit and did a lot of damage!"
"Ah, you successfully tripped him!"
"Um, cool. I guess."​

There are plenty of ways in which 4E is more abstract than 3E. Hit points are more abstract. Healing surges are more abstract. The entire framework of the game is more abstract, in how PCs and NPCs play by different rules. This fits right in.

Even the specific nature of powers is highly abstract. How did you do 3[w] + Str damage in a close burst with a sword? Isn't AoE damage supposed to be the domain of boom spells? Don't think too hard about it.

 

[hong]

So in very specific circumstances, it is possible with DM permission to fake the character I want to play because mechanically I can't back him up...ok.

If your DM really will not let you describe the process of defeating a bad guy as involving a takedown with literally no mechanical significance whatsoever, then your DM is stupid. Find a better DM.

This is, even for you, really stretching it hong...it presupposes you will defeat an opponent each round (which with 4e's game design is nearly impossible).

This is what minions are for. Hint: when ppl in action movies wade through a dozen enemies at a time, this is what they are.