Does True Seeing see some who is using Hide in Plain Sight

[Bagpuss]

So, True Seeing would negate Hide in Plain Sight (Su).

FIFY

but it would not negate Hide in Plain Sight (Ex)

 

[KarinsDad]

FIFY

but it would not negate Hide in Plain Sight (Ex)

I wasn't aware that there was a "Hide in Plain Sight (Ex)" ability anywhere. Could you post where this could be found?

Hide in Plain Sight (Ex) sounds like an oxymoron anyway.

Extraordinary abilities are nonmagical.

I guess some form of camoflague might work here as an Ex ability, but not one a PC should typically be able to get (just certain types of monsters usually).

 

[Corsair]

I wasn't aware that there was a "Hide in Plain Sight (Ex)" ability anywhere. Could you post where this could be found?

Hide in Plain Sight (Ex) sounds like an oxymoron anyway.



I guess some form of camoflague might work here as an Ex ability, but not one a PC should typically be able to get (just certain types of monsters usually).

Camouflage (Ex): A ranger of 13th level or higher can use the Hide skill in any sort of natural terrain, even if the terrain doesn’t grant cover or concealment.

Hide in Plain Sight (Ex): While in any sort of natural terrain, a ranger of 17th level or higher can use the Hide skill even while being observed.

 

[pawsplay]

Hm. True seeing would penetrate Hide in Plain Sight. However, hide in plain sight is used only briefly, to hide. Thus, the shadowdancer is now hidden and cannot be seen.

Thus, true seeing will prevent a shadowdancer from hiding (no concealment). However, if you chanced upon one who was already hiding, no luck.

 

[KarinsDad]

Hm. True seeing would penetrate Hide in Plain Sight. However, hide in plain sight is used only briefly, to hide. Thus, the shadowdancer is now hidden and cannot be seen.

Thus, true seeing will prevent a shadowdancer from hiding (no concealment). However, if you chanced upon one who was already hiding, no luck.

Not quite:

You need cover or concealment in order to attempt a Hide check. Total cover or total concealment usually (but not always; see Special, below) obviates the need for a Hide check, since nothing can see you anyway.

If people are observing you, even casually, you can’t hide.

Hide in Plain Sight allows one to hide out in the open. If one is out in the open, people can casually observe you if your HiPS concealment vanishes.

 

[pawsplay]

Not quite:



Hide in Plain Sight allows one to hide out in the open. If one is out in the open, people can casually observe you if your HiPS concealment vanishes.

But is that what happens? You can Hide by creating a distraction, or by moving into concealment. Hide in Plain Sight does not actually provide concealment.

 

[KarinsDad]

But is that what happens? You can Hide by creating a distraction, or by moving into concealment. Hide in Plain Sight does not actually provide concealment.

You are correct that one can Hide by creating a distraction. But, he still has to be in concealment or cover in order to hide. Create all of the distractions he wants, he cannot hide without cover or concealment.

You need cover or concealment in order to attempt a Hide check.

If one was hiding in the concealment of a Fog Cloud and the duration of the Fog Cloud expired, that character would suddenly be out in the open without concealment (assuming normal lighting conditions), would be exposed, and could not hide (shy of HiPS or Invisibility or something).

Since True Seeing sees through normal darkness, even the concealment of normal shadowy illumination is not enough to grant concealment against True Seeing.


This, of course, does not apply to someone with non-darkness concealment (e.g. fog or branches) who is also using HiPS. Such a character would have concealment against the True Seeing and would still be hiding. He is not using HiPS in this case, just normal hiding. But assuming the character is out in the open, the moment True Seeing is cast is the moment that HiPS and hiding goes away.

 

[Bagpuss]

I've only got the SRD to quote here so lets look at the Assassin and Rangers Hide in Plain Sight

First the Assassin
Hide in Plain Sight (Su)

At 8th level, an assassin can use the Hide skill even while being observed. As long as he is within 10 feet of some sort of shadow, an assassin can hide himself from view in the open without having anything to actually hide behind. He cannot, however, hide in his own shadow.

Then the Ranger
Hide in Plain Sight (Ex)
While in any sort of natural terrain, a ranger of 17th level or higher can use the Hide skill even while being observed.

To me the Assassin uses a magical ability to either make himself appear as an extension of the shadow he must be near or magically bends that shadow to conceal himself. Hide in Plain sight does not require him to move into actual concealment. Thus Tree Seeing defeats this. For the Ranger it is a nonmagical method of having a ghillie suit or other ability so that while you see him you don't recognise him as a person, hence Tree Seeing doesn't work.

 

[Kmart Kommando]

Actually, the Shadowdancer is screwed. True Seeing says .."sees through normal and magical darkness.."

 

[Sejs]

Actually, the Shadowdancer is screwed. True Seeing says .."sees through normal and magical darkness.."

Seeing thru darkness does not negate a shadowdancer's ability to HiPS.

The shadows need to be present - they do not have to in any way impede the person you're hiding from's vision.

If seeing thru darkness negated a shadowdancer's ability to HiPS, no shadowdancer over 2nd level could ever hide in plain sight, because they get darkvision.