D&D (2024) Does WotC view the Monk class as overtuned from their perspective?

[Clint_L]

Rolling or using standard array are both presented as baseline options for stats, with point buy later included as an option:

You generate your character’s six ability scores randomly. Roll four 6-sided dice and record the total of the highest three dice on a piece of scratch paper. Do this five more times, so that you have six numbers. If you want to save time or don’t like the idea of randomly determining ability scores, you can use the following scores instead: 15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8.

The most recent information we have is that most players use either point buy or standard array (with point buy being the more popular) but a significant minority still prefer to roll, using a variety of different methods.

 

[shadowoflameth]

That's an uncharitable and unearned description of people whose perspective differs from your own.

I have no problem with differing opinions from my (passionate) one about this, and again, play the way you enjoy, but playing an unarmed specialist martial with a d4 weapon that has to spend points to do what a fighter can do at-will with d6 or d8 from 1st level is objectively bad design. If the fighter picks up a martial weapon to do d10s or d12s, or takes feats at level 1 or level 4 the gap gets larger. Wanting the Monk to be effective at all is not power gaming, it's wanting the class that specializes in Unarmed combat to do fun unarmed things including not being useless in a party where everything he does is done better inherently by someone else.

 

[strawbellebelle]

I have no problem with differing opinions from my (passionate) one about this, and again, play the way you enjoy, but playing an unarmed specialist martial with a d4 weapon that has to spend points to do what a fighter can do at-will with d6 or d8 from 1st level is objectively bad design. If the fighter picks up a martial weapon to do d10s or d12s, or takes feats at level 1 or level 4 the gap gets larger. Wanting the Monk to be effective at all is not power gaming, it's wanting the class that specializes in Unarmed combat to do fun unarmed things including not being useless in a party where everything he does is done better inherently by someone else.

A Monk using a spear or staff (d8 with versatile) with their bonus strike outdamages the Fighter at first level without using any points.

It's not the game's fault that you are blatantly and unapologetically playing the game wrong.

 

[James Gasik]

Fighter w/ Short Sword/ and bonus action Short Sword, 16 Dexterity, Two-Weapon Fighting. Damage: 1d6+3/1d6+3. Average damage: 13.

Monk w/Staff (versatile) and bonus action Unarmed Strike, 16 Dexterity. Damage: 1d8+3/1d4+3. Average damage: 13.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

A Monk using a spear or staff (d8 with versatile) with their bonus strike outdamages the Fighter at first level without using any points.

It's not the game's fault that you are blatantly and unapologetically playing the game wrong.

Yes, let's blame those stupid monks for wanting to punch and kick stuff rather than playing the game right!

 

[Gammadoodler]

A Monk using a spear or staff (d8 with versatile) with their bonus strike outdamages the Fighter at first level without using any points.

It's not the game's fault that you are blatantly and unapologetically playing the game wrong.

Now who's powergaming?

 

[strawbellebelle]

Yes, let's blame those stupid monks for wanting to punch and kick stuff rather than playing the game right!

There is no reasoning with people who desperately want to feel victimized by the Monk not being patently overpowered at 1st level.

Or moderators who flip their lids when you call self-centered power-gamers out on their persecution fantasy.

 

[tetrasodium]

Yes, let's blame those stupid monks for wanting to punch and kick stuff rather than playing the game right!

So the problem is that when monks choose to go without a weapon that they even have the ability to use a martial arts die for unarmed damage instead of the same unarmed attack as everyone else. Easy solution would be to remove that option to keep from misleading you about the type of game that d&d is....

 

[Neonchameleon]

Fighter w/ Short Sword/ and bonus action Short Sword, 16 Dexterity, Two-Weapon Fighting. Damage: 1d6+3/1d6+3. Average damage: 13.

Monk w/Staff (versatile) and bonus action Unarmed Strike, 16 Dexterity. Damage: 1d8+3/1d4+3. Average damage: 13.

Which means that the monk doesn't hit a lot harder than the highest damage fighter type at low level (that notoriously doesn't scale well past level 4 as you gain less from a second attack than people who hit harder with their main weapon, and feats and class features provide some bonus action attacks) - but it is strictly better than the single highest damage fighter option as there are a few times you don't get your bonus action.

It moves to significantly more dangerous than even the highest damage fighter at level 2 when Action Surge only adds a single 1d6+3 damage per short rest, while you get 2 ki points for Flurry per short rest (plus one per level above 2).

Of course this level range is when Second Wind really matters...

 

[Clint_L]

Which means that the monk doesn't hit a lot harder than the highest damage fighter type at low level (that notoriously doesn't scale well past level 4 as you gain less from a second attack than people who hit harder with their main weapon, and feats and class features provide some bonus action attacks) - but it is strictly better than the single highest damage fighter option as there are a few times you don't get your bonus action.

It moves to significantly more dangerous than even the highest damage fighter at level 2 when Action Surge only adds a single 1d6+3 damage per short rest, while you get 2 ki points for Flurry per short rest (plus one per level above 2).

Of course this level range is when Second Wind really matters...

So what you're saying is that at Level 2 the fighter does almost the same damage as the monk while having about double the survivability (way more if they want to swap to a shield)? Seems balanced!

Of course, the monk does have an extra 5' of movement.