Double Weapons as Two-Handed Weapons

[Oomancer]

Can all double weapons be used as two-handed weapons - for example, when you don't have a full attack action and just want to swing it with two hands? Also, can they all be used as one-handed weapons when you have the weapon in one hand and a shield on the other?

I'm particularly thinking of the double sword, but I think the questions apply to all of them.

Thanks in advance.

Oomancer
"Don't shoot until you see the whites of their eggs."

 

[javcs]

Well, you can when you use one end of it to do so, but only one end, and it must be the same end for all attacks that round.

 

[Hedgemage]

Yes. Any time you choose to forgo the off hand attacks (or can only make one attack) you can wield a double weapon as a two-handed weapon and apply the 1.5X STR bonus to damage. A perfect example is the quarterstaff. Anyone can use it as a 2-hand weapon and get the extra damage mod even though you need a feat to use it as a double weapon.

 

[FalcWP]

Yes. Any time you choose to forgo the off hand attacks (or can only make one attack) you can wield a double weapon as a two-handed weapon and apply the 1.5X STR bonus to damage. A perfect example is the quarterstaff. Anyone can use it as a 2-hand weapon and get the extra damage mod even though you need a feat to use it as a double weapon.

Actually, you don't even need the feat to use it as a double weapon. But you'd take a -4 penalty for the "primary hand" (in this case, the end that gets your full Strength bonus) and a -8 for the "off hand" (the end with just half your strength bonus) if you don't have Two Weapon Fighting.

I don't beleive that you can use a double weapon as a one-handed weapon to gain the benefit of a shield. They are all listed as being "Two-Handed Melee Weapons". You might be able to make the arguement for a couple of them (For instance, the hooked hammer), but that'd be DM dependent.

 

[Fedifensor]

Yes. Any time you choose to forgo the off hand attacks (or can only make one attack) you can wield a double weapon as a two-handed weapon and apply the 1.5X STR bonus to damage. A perfect example is the quarterstaff. Anyone can use it as a 2-hand weapon and get the extra damage mod even though you need a feat to use it as a double weapon.

And if your game in in Eberron, you can use the Revenant Blade PrC out of Player's Guide to Eberron and get the 1.5 STR to damage while wielding a double weapon (with all of your off-hand attacks, no less).

 

[EyeontheMountain]

Actually, you don't even need the feat to use it as a double weapon. But you'd take a -4 penalty for the "primary hand" (in this case, the end that gets your full Strength bonus) and a -8 for the "off hand" (the end with just half your strength bonus) if you don't have Two Weapon Fighting.

I don't beleive that you can use a double weapon as a one-handed weapon to gain the benefit of a shield. They are all listed as being "Two-Handed Melee Weapons". You might be able to make the arguement for a couple of them (For instance, the hooked hammer), but that'd be DM dependent.

The way I see it is if they are listed as large weapons, medium sized characters cannot use them one handed. A small gnome hooked hammer might be, and probably is butthe weapon size rules.

 

[Hypersmurf]

The way I see it is if they are listed as large weapons, medium sized characters cannot use them one handed.

That's 3E mechanics; in 3.5, they're all listed as 'Two-Handed Weapons', which can be Small, Medium, Large, or whatever.

The answer to this question was actually clearer in the 3E PHB, because it was assumed that all weapons being described (for the most part) were sized for a Medium creature, so it was easier for them to give an example. But the rules are still trackable in 3.5.

We know three things:

1. Two hands are required to use a two-handed melee weapon effectively.
2. The measure of how much effort it takes to use a weapon (whether the weapon is designated as a light, one-handed, or two-handed weapon for a particular wielder) is altered by one step for each size category of difference between the wielder’s size and the size of the creature for which the weapon was designed.
3. A creature wielding a double weapon in one hand can’t use it as a double weapon—only one end of the weapon can be used in any given round.

Let's say we have a human (a Medium creature) with a Medium two-bladed sword (a two-handed weapon, and a double weapon).

Does point 3 mean that he can wield it in one hand, because it is a double weapon? No; point 3 tells us the consequences of wielding a double weapon in one hand, but it does not give you permission to do so if another rule prevents it. And in this case, another rule does; for the human, the two-bladed sword is a two-handed melee weapon, and point 1 tells us that he requires two hands to use it. Point 3 is true but irrelevant; since he cannot wield it in one hand, the rule does not matter to him.

Now let's say an ogre (a Large creature) takes the same Medium two-bladed sword. Point 2 tells us that since the ogre is one size category larger than the sword, it is treated as a one-handed weapon instead of a two-handed weapon for him. So, for the ogre in this case, point 1 does not apply; the sword is not a two-handed weapon. Thus, he can wield it in one hand. What happens in this case? Point 3 tells us that he can do so, but he can only use one end in a given round.

Similarly, the human could use any Small double weapon (such as a hooked hammer sized for a gnome) in one hand, but could only use one end each round.

-Hyp.

 

[Li Shenron]

Trying to give a more concise answer...

Can all double weapons be used as two-handed weapons - for example, when you don't have a full attack action and just want to swing it with two hands?

Yes. Just don't get the extra attack(s), but also don't get the 2WF penalties.

Actually in a full-attack you might use both ends of the weapon even if you're not taking the penalties, as long as you're not getting the extra attack.

Also, can they all be used as one-handed weapons when you have the weapon in one hand and a shield on the other?

No, they are too large to be used one-handed.
Unless you're using a double weapon made for a creature smaller than you, but in that case it won't work as a double weapon for you.

 

[Starglim]

I'd say:

1. You can attack with only one end of a double weapon. In this case it counts as a one-handed weapon wielded in two hands. It still counts as an exotic weapon.

2. No, you cannot wield a double weapon effectively with one hand even if you only use one end of it, edit: except, as pointed out by Hypersmurf, if it's smaller than your size.

Consider using the attack action with the weapon, or deciding to forego the use of two-weapon fighting. There's no essential difference from these uses to the use that you're suggesting in #1. In fact, they're mechanically identical.

 

[Hypersmurf]

2. No, you cannot wield a double weapon effectively with one hand even if you only use one end of it, edit: except, as pointed out by Hypersmurf, if it's smaller than your size.

It's a question that's come up fairly frequently in the past - a lot of people read the line about "If you use a double weapon in one hand", and assume that there's an implicit permission in there... "There wouldn't be a rule for it if you couldn't do it!"

In 3E, it was clearer, because it had a "For example, an ogre using a two-bladed sword" clause that made it obvious that it was only allowed if you were larger than the weapon.

-Hyp.