Dwarf power-ups: Good or bad?

[drnuncheon]

If weapon familiarity is going to work the way I think it's going to work (i.e. a dwarf will be able to use the dwarven waraxe or urgrosh w/o penalty as if they had the EWP)

It doesn't.

Weapon familiarity with a weapon turns it from an exotic weapon to a martial weapon.

You won't see any more dwarven wizards waving waraxes than you do now, but your dwarven fighters that use them will wind up with a spare feat.

J

 

[coyote6]

Exotic weapons are not "rarer" necessarily.

Yeah. Check out those random weapon tables in the DMG. Weapon most likely to come up on the "Common Melee Weapons" table (and thus the most common melee weapon): longsword (at 13%). Second most likely to come up: waraxe, dwarven (at 11%). Magic* waraxes should be almost 20 times more common than magic battleaxes, if I figure correctly.

*Note that the mundane items treasure table also refers to the same set of weapons tables, so nonmagic waraxes should be more common than nonmagic battleaxes, too.

 

[MadScientist]

It doesn't.

Weapon familiarity with a weapon turns it from an exotic weapon to a martial weapon.

You won't see any more dwarven wizards waving waraxes than you do now, but your dwarven fighters that use them will wind up with a spare feat.

J

Thanx for explaining exactly how the weapon familiarity works. It really doesn't address any of my reservations about it though, since I think most of the unbalancing/undesireable aspects of racial WF with exotic weapons pertain to classes with martial weapon proficiencies.

Edit: spelling

 

[Psiblade]

I really do not mind the dwarves getting a free feat for the war axe, but half-elves are really underpowered now. I can not image how bad they will be in 3.5.


-Psiblade

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

As others have pointed out, as it is, it doesn't do anything but tip the weapon in favor of the martial classes. I'd rather it was tipped in favor of the whole race.

Seems to me the way they should have done WF, is to give a free martial weapon proficiency in the weapon to every member of the race. (Sort of how the War domain gives a martial weapon proficiency in a single weapon to a cleric.)

That way all dwarves-- steeped in dwarven culture, but regardless of class-- can use the waraxe (two handed) as a martial weapon.

I mean, I guess I had thought that the purpose of extending the exotic weapons was to show how certain races "grow up" familiar with the weapon-- in which case it shouldn't matter whether or not they belong to a class that gets martial weapon proficiencies.

Wulf

 

[MadScientist]

I agree Wulf. I would have much rather have seen all dwarves get an automatic Martial Proficiency than a free EWP for folks who already get martial weapon proficiencies.

 

[Squire James]

For half-orcs, I favor a +2 racial bonus to Survival skill, and if it still exists the Track feat for free. This is fairly useful in conjunction with Darkvision (dwarves aren't the only guys who has it, you know!). Basically, all races need some sort of useful non-combat ability.

Half-elves are a tougher nut to crack. In danger of making them a too-popular choice, I'd suggest the player gets to choose which "half" of human ability he gets: extra skill points OR the bonus feat. Or tie it to how he was raised: a half-elf raised by elves get the bonus feat, and a half-elf raised by humans gets the skill points (or the other way around).

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

Half-elves are a tougher nut to crack. In danger of making them a too-popular choice...

Anything the designers can do to reduce the number of half-elf artsy-fartsy "I want to waste the rest of the group's evening while I seduce the serving wench" poseurs in the game is ok in my book.

Wulf "Not a Big Fan of the Social Skills" Ratbane

 

[Felon]

If the DM wants to balance it out, just don't hand out magical Dwarven Waraxes. Heck, if they are exotic, they're assumed to be much more rare, and therefore won't be found in treasure piles.

This is exactly what I was talking about before: people are interpreting the term "exotic" incorrectly. Waraxes--or for that matter whips and bastard swords--are not exotic in the same way that a wild flower or a panda bear is. It's not the weapon that's supposed to be rare, but rather the combat technique required to wield it proficiently.

Like Ravellion said, it should have been called "Advanced" or "Special" Weapon Proficiency. For want of one little bit of syntax 3.5e will be introducing a new harebrained rule.

 

[Felon]

If weapon familiarity is going to work the way I think it's going to work (i.e. a dwarf will be able to use the dwarven waraxe or urgrosh w/o penalty as if they had the EWP) it is a huge balance problem. Getting one EWP for free is much better than getting a few MWP's for free like the Elf does. Why? Because an elf Fighter, Ranger or Barbarian would get all of the martial proficiencies anyway, in these cases they are redundant. They are only useful if you have no "fighter type" levels, it which case you are generally a sub-optimal fighter anyway (uber cleric archers aside). In the case of a Dwarf fighter, that character gets to use a weapon that is superior to all the martial weapons for free! This is a clear advantage over "fighter types" from races w/o the free EWP.

Thanks, Mad, you just saved me a whole lot of typing, as I was basically about to say the same thing. Odd how simple observations like that have to be pointed to some folks. Seeing the occasional voice of reason in threads like this makes'em a lot more bearable.

Originally posted by Wulf Ratbane
Seems to me the way they should have done WF, is to give a free martial weapon proficiency in the weapon to every member of the race. (Sort of how the War domain gives a martial weapon proficiency in a single weapon to a cleric.) That way all dwarves-- steeped in dwarven culture, but regardless of class-- can use the waraxe (two handed) as a martial weapon.

It sounds like you're basically just saying all dwarves should have been proficiency with the waraxe. Now THAT would have been broken. Dwarven rogues and wizards being able to wield a one-handed weapon that's superior to what half-orc barbarians, elven rangers, human fighters, etc. receive proficicency with.

Then again, I suppose if enough DM's start incorporating that broken rule into their campaigns, we might see it become offical in 4e.