D&D General Eberron - why don't you run it? [-]

[Eyes of Nine]

Also a call out for Campion (Margery Allingham) because that moves between pulp adventure and detective noir.

Two books into Campion and I feel like it even leans towards slapstick. But both of the novels so far have had a big brawl towards the end, so I guess that's leaning more pulp.

 

[Scribe]

I find people with this sort of power fantasy quite scary.

Is it a British thing that we would rather go home and tend our little gardens?

If it is, plenty of Canadians picked it up from our shared history. I was just telling my son, once or if you can retire with your wife, take care of your house and tend to the plants? You've won.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

i think modern Noir tends to go so far over the edge that everything is predictably going to screw you and nobody is really going to win. I never return to any game like that. Just no fun. If you are talking 50's Noir where a good ending is at least possible and not everyone will screw you then I'm ok with that .

That sounds more like grimdark to me. There certainly some noir stories even before the 50s were protagonist can’t win, it’s not a required part of the genre. And with those, you can say they shouldn’t have become involved in a murder plot in the first place. But, whilst noir stories have lots of twists and moral greyness*, the protagonist can certainly win sometimes. Of course, the protagonist may not be “good”. There are a bunch of Harlan Coburn (and similar) thrillers on Netflix at the moment. They are noir.

*Phillip Marlowe is sometimes described as a tarnished paladin. The one good man in a world full of bad people. Sam Spade on the other hand has a moral code similar to Conan’s.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Two books into Campion and I feel like it even leans towards slapstick. But both of the novels so far have had a big brawl towards the end, so I guess that's leaning more pulp.

Oh, keep reading, Campion goes off in all sorts of different directions. Wait until he has amnesia whist involved with a nest of nefarious foreign spies. And there is an Indiana Jones style treasure hunt in another story.

 

[Scott Christian]

Which books do you have? The original 3.5e Eberron Campaign Setting doesn't use the word "noir" much, preferring "dark" instead. There's a sidebar with a list of inspirational movies, including The Maltese Falcon, The Mummy, Raiders of the Lost Ark, etc.

The 5e book has a section in the first chapter labeled "Noir Intrigue": "Eberron draws inspiration from noir and hard-boiled fiction. It’s a world where stories don’t always end well, and where there isn’t a perfect solution for every problem. In developing characters or stories in Eberron, consider the following concepts."

Its sub-sections include "Everyone Has Regrets", "Personal Motives", "Shades of Gray", and "Something to Lose".

I really think that is part of the problem some people have with the setting. Noir has no business fitting in with the perceived setting and mood of Eberron.

I get it, the lore does have elements of noir. But almost all of the D&D setting do. So to use it as a focus, seems out of place for someone perusing the 5e Eberron book.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I really think that is part of the problem some people have with the setting. Noir has no business fitting in with the perceived setting and mood of Eberron.

I get it, the lore does have elements of noir. But almost all of the D&D setting do. So to use it as a focus, seems out of place for someone perusing the 5e Eberron book.

Then maybe should stop using it as an explicit setting descriptor, if it's so out of place. People don't generally call Dragonlance or the Realms as "noir", but it's pretty common to apply to Eberron.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Then maybe should stop using it as an explicit setting descriptor, if it's so out of place. People don't generally call Dragonlance or the Realms as "noir", but it's pretty common to apply to Eberron.

It’s a better known term than “novels and movies from the first half of the 20th century that are not fantasy”.

 

[Scott Christian]

Then maybe should stop using it as an explicit setting descriptor, if it's so out of place. People don't generally call Dragonlance or the Realms as "noir", but it's pretty common to apply to Eberron.

Maybe. I am really just stating an observation I have seen over the years with the setting. Noir being fatalistic, cynical, and full of moral ambiguity applies to so many different aspects of D&D lore; and it has very few game mechanic representations as well.

 

[Micah Sweet]

It’s a better known term than “novels and movies from the first half of the 20th century that are not fantasy”.

Then why don't they call all the other settings noir too, if the premise of the poster to whom I was responding is correct?

 

[Voadam]

Maybe. I am really just stating an observation I have seen over the years with the setting. Noir being fatalistic, cynical, and full of moral ambiguity applies to so many different aspects of D&D lore; and it has very few game mechanic representations as well.

I felt that the mechanic of any alignment clerics and taking out the loss of powers for violating religious precepts in 3e was hugely impactful in making things shades of gray compared to most other D&D.