Effects of taking feats more than once?

[Quartz]

The PHB p165 says that you can't take feats more than once, unless explicitly allowed by the feat. What are the effects of ignoring that? There are plenty of feats that could be taken more than once:

Elemental Adept (already allowed)
Lucky
Magic Initiate
Martial Adept
Resilient
Savage Attacker
Skilled
Tough
Weapon Master.

But how would allowing it affect game balance? None of those seem particularly obnoxious, except perhaps Lucky.

 

[SkidAce]

I am interested in the ramifications of doing this also.

It might mess up the lines between classes, but for home games I don't see the problem so far.

 

[Fanaelialae]

The PHB p165 says that you can't take feats more than once, unless explicitly allowed by the feat. What are the effects of ignoring that? There are plenty of feats that could be taken more than once:

Elemental Adept (already allowed)

Lucky

Probably overkill. Three rerolls a day is already fairly generous. Taken to absurdity a PC might have 15 or more rerolls each day. There are plenty of days my players don't make 15 rolls.

Magic Initiate

I think I'd be okay with this one.

Martial Adept

I'd probably be okay with this one as well.

Resilient

I actually thought you could take this multiple times. That said, it's a very good feat. There are some players who would definitely take this four times if it was allowed (I have one at my table who was planning exactly that). You might want to avoid this one on the basis that some players will treat it as a required feat that uses up most of their feat options.

Savage Attacker

Probably fine. It's not an amazingly strong feat to begin with.

Skilled

Another one I thought you could take multiple times. Should be fine as long as you don't mind the possibility of one PC having proficiency with every skill (I don't take issue with it).

Tough

I'd be careful about this one. A human fighter can have 8 feats by level 19. At level 20 that would mean 320 additional HP. That's a LOT of extra HP!

Weapon Master.

Another one I thought you could take multiple times. I don't see why you would, but I also don't see the harm.

But how would allowing it affect game balance? None of those seem particularly obnoxious, except perhaps Lucky.

 

[Sunseeker]

I pretty much agree with Fanaelialae. I don't see any reason that these feats shouldn't be able to be taken more than once. By 20th level I don't think even taking "tough" 8 times or gaining proficiency in all saves to be that unreasonable.

 

[bedir than]

I like the idea of a higher level magic initiate feat, one that requires the original feat. I'm thinking about allowing another cantrip and 2nd level spell (again once per day). Both must be from the same class as the original initiate feat.

Maybe I'm odd, but I'd prefer feats as a method to pick up backdoor dips into classes rather than multi-classing.

 

[Agamon]

I let our sorcerer take Magic Initiate a second time, though I told her to pick a new class. Not sure why. On the spot gut call, though on further thought, I'm not sure why you couldn't pick spells from the same class.

 

[aramis erak]

With Magic Initiate, the Fighter-Eldritch Knight can get over a dozen cantrips, and over 10 first level slots...
Some abusive versions:

MI-Wizard C: flame bolt, ice knife 1: Magic Missile
MI-Sorcerer C: burning hands, shocking grasp, 1: Magic missile.

So, said fighter now (1) adds magic missile to known spells, and (2) has 2/day castings of magic missile @ level 1, a built in ranged attack, a built-in melee attack, plus his own 2x 1st level slots... at 6th level. He's got almost as much magic as a 1st level wizard.
So at 8, he adds MI-Warlock C: eldritch bolt, creat fire, 1: Magic Missile...

By 20th level, he's spamming off with 10 castings of MM, and a lightning bolt.

 

[Li Shenron]

I suppose that WotC is just being overly careful in order to avoid powergaming exploits...

As a house rule, I think it is very possible to allow some feats to be taken multiple times. I would kind of follow this rule of thumb:

- does a second feat increase the range of applicability? (e.g. grants the same benefit on a different weapon group, same defensive bonus vs different element, different spell school etc) > Allow

- does a second feat increase the bonus on the same d20 roll or similar? (incl. attack rolls, AC, ST, ability/skill checks) > Disallow

- does a second feat increase quantities of known stuff / quantitative results / numbers of use? (incl. damage, HP, number of proficiencies, spells known, uses/day) Allow with limitations*

*By "limitations" I mean maybe allow a second or third feat but not more, depending on the cases

 

[Greenstone.Walker]

With Magic Initiate, the Fighter-Eldritch Knight can get over a dozen cantrips
MI-Wizard C: flame bolt, ice knife 1: Magic Missile
MI-Sorcerer C: burning hands, shocking grasp, 1: Magic missile.

So, said fighter now (1) adds magic missile to known spells,

She can now cast magic missile twice per long rest, both at level 1 (i.e. 3 darts) but she can't use spell slots to cast it, so I don't think I'd use the phrasing "known spells".

Additionally, the spell attack bonuses for those cantrips are likely to be low, as they will be abilities an eldritch knight doesn't generally put lots of points into. Magic Initiate (Sorcerer) and Magic Initiate (Warlock) both use CHA - typically a dump stat for fighters.

She does have an extremely large number of cantrips, true, which can be extremely useful out of combat. Personally, I'd be picking cantrips like create bonfire, minor illusion, message, and so on. I think an eldritch knight taking something like shocking grasp is pointless. If something is close enough to use shocking grasp, they are close enough to be whacked with a weapon (using STR or DEX - not a dump stat!).

Finally, this took a couple of feats. She could have picked shield master or war caster or great weapon master and so on. Feats should be pretty good.

 

[Quartz]

The point about Toughness is well made.