This is most likely why it was manslaughter and not 2nd degree- she went from gun to her head to killing her husband without a significant cooling off period.
Ends justifying the means
- Thread starter Bullgrit
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This is most likely why it was manslaughter and not 2nd degree- she went from gun to her head to killing her husband without a significant cooling off period.
The case as I have read and seen it presented essentially say the same thing: she was sitting in her room, finger in the trigger, then contemplated her daughter's possible molestation if she were not around to protect her. She then immediately got up, sent her kid next door, shot her husband, and called the cops. It was all a sequence of minutes.
Prosecutors are fairly politically minded here in the USA. It's usually a stepping stone job for those with political aspirations. As such, they are not in the habit of making plea deals to give murderers suspended sentences when they're not going after "bigger fish" and they have a confession and the literal smoking gun. But that is exactly what happened here.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/2010/01/08/maine-woman-who-killed-husband-wont-go-to-prison/
As for suicide as provocation, no. Suicide as state of fear and anger, with the constant state of mental and physical abuse, plus a just-realized fear that her daughter would be her husband's next victim as provocation.
We know he had 16 encounters with the police- admittedly some as victim- for violence with no arrests. She may have perceived that the police would not help. With his wealth, she may not have felt able to run far enough away.
Against that backdrop, she made the decision to kill herself, then changed her mind and acted to kill her tormentor.
Kramodlog
Naked and living in a barrel
Possible, but not that clear:
Not sure how long all of this took.
Yup, but this is very a special case. It is very easy to feel sympathy for this woman. There were 50 protestors with "free Amber" shirts outside apparently. Going for a conviction might backfire and not help that political career, as the procecutor would look insensitive.
. She sounded rather in control.
Well, this is one of those things in US law that is drafted and interpreted broadly. "Cooling off" periods in homicide statutes are almost always defined by a "reasonable man" standard, and Maine is no exception. So what happens is they have to convince a jury (or judge, depending) that "in ________ situation, a reasonable man" would not have cooled down.
Because this was a negotiated sentence, we can infer that the prosecutor did not believe he could convince 12 jurors that there was sufficient time to cool down.
That's nothing unusual at all. You'd see much the same in any BWS type case in the USA. And yet, it is rarely a successful defense.
Again, the prosecutor clearly didn't think he could convince a jury of that, at least not to the standard required by law, so he settled for a negotiated plea deal.
Remember, he's working with a LOT more data than we'd find in a news report- he's got expert testimony reports, police reports, officer depositions, other witness testimony (the daughter, the 911 operator, the neighbors, etc.), possible police reports displaying a pattern of business behavior, etc.
And a dirty bomb. And the FBI talking about its sophistication and completeness.
All this would have been entered into evidence and weighed by a jury. He looks at all of this. He's got experience with the judges in the area. He's got experience with how liberal or conservative the jurors in his county tend to trend. He's going to look at what is spread out on his desk and decide whether he can win this case, and of so, what it would take.
And looking at all of this, he decided to settle.
(Oh yeah- complete non sequitur, goldomark- you might not want to use too many colors in the dark grey/black/blue side of things, since that's next to invisible against the black background of the forum's Legacy skin setting.)
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Homicidal_Squirrel
Adventurer
These are actually another of the criticisms of BPS/BWS.
In the case of child-molester-Nazi guy, I think it became clear to the prosecutor that even though the woman had broken the law, it was gong to be really hard for any juror to convict based on the dead gy being a nazi... who was building a bomb... to kill the President... and he was sexually attracted to children. I mean, Nazi alone? Yeah, she more than likely would have been convicted. Nazi and likes little girls? She could have tortured him for days before tossing him feet first into a wood-chipper and people would still find it hard to convicted her because they would have thought he deserved it.
I get the feeling the defense hired a legal psychologist while the prosecutor decided the save a few bucks. They cold have avoided spending all that money on a trial and gotten the same results.
Which is actually why this happens, or doesn't happen.
Usually, the person claiming BPS kills the other person while the other person is vulnerable, like the sleeping nazi. It contradicts the idea that the battered person killed their abuser because of some "syndrome" or pathology. Basically, the idea is that all the years of abuse have caused a mental breakdown in the victim. They have "learned helplessness." So the victim, not thinking rationally, kills their tormentor because that is the only way they can be safe, or so they think. However, this abusers are for the most part killed when they are helpless or in some way vulnerable. You have to admit that it takes a certain clarity of mind to identify moments of vulnerability and act at that time to end the other person's life.
In the case of child-molester-Nazi guy, I think it became clear to the prosecutor that even though the woman had broken the law, it was gong to be really hard for any juror to convict based on the dead gy being a nazi... who was building a bomb... to kill the President... and he was sexually attracted to children. I mean, Nazi alone? Yeah, she more than likely would have been convicted. Nazi and likes little girls? She could have tortured him for days before tossing him feet first into a wood-chipper and people would still find it hard to convicted her because they would have thought he deserved it.
I get the feeling the defense hired a legal psychologist while the prosecutor decided the save a few bucks. They cold have avoided spending all that money on a trial and gotten the same results.
Kramodlog
Naked and living in a barrel
You're the one who implied that a few minutes was not enough for a cool off:
.All I pointed out was that we didn't know how long it took from what we can glean from the article you linked.
A wife beating nazi child molesting nuclear terrorist isn't that unusual!?
Maybe, we certainly do not have all the info. It also might be better for his/her political career to be gentle with Mrs. Beaten by a nazi child molesting nuclear terrorist.
He/she could also feel sympathy for the lady. Althought that raises question of professionalism.
Derailing threads is evil.
I'll try to pay attention to it.
While we don't know the exact timeline, we do know ht it all occurred within the span of an otherwise normal (for them) morning.
I was referring to the crowds of supporters. Nearly every BWS case draws crowds of supporters in or near the courthouse.
Well, it certainly couldn't help his case for murder that the FBI press releases described her husband's multiple terror-weapon making endeavors to be well-funded, sophisticated, and in an advanced state of completion.
Still, there is yet one more step in the plea arrangement process that acts as a safeguard: any pleas must be accepted and signed by the court- often not an elected position. If the judge finds the plea arrangement to be against the law or not in the public's interest, it can be rejected, and the case continues. (Maine criminal court judges are appointed for 6 year terms, not elected, so they're theoretically a bit less politically motivated.)
And the judge in this case- who also saw the evidence- was very confident in the decision to accept the plea, as is clear from his comments in this article:
http://bangordailynews.com/2010/01/07/news/no-jail-for-woman-who-killed-husband/
For some reason, because of one of the recent software updates, text that is copied & pasted sometimes gets unwanted color editing when it gets posted.
Kramodlog
Naked and living in a barrel
Indeed, but it doesn't clarify the cool off question.
Except her defense was about her daughter, not fear that other people would be hurt by the bomb.
I'm sure he was. It is not like the risk of a public backlash was great with this case. The problem is that public opinion or personal sentiments shouldn't have any bearing on a court case or its sentencing.
Not just sometimes, but modifying the color before posting the text doesn't always change it. Same for size. I blame Morrus for being cheap.
Zombie_Babies
First Post
Yup. They assassinated his character to provide a handy excuse for her assassination of him. We all get this dood was bad news, he just wasn't doing anything at the time that warranted his immediate killing.
I've been saying it over and over again (aren't internet debates fun?
). I don't believe she was adequately provoked. He posed no immediate threat and that's something that, quite simply, cannot be argued. He was asleep. So far as we know the child was not molested at any previous point and he had no confirmed plans to molest her in the future.
