Essentials nostalgia - the death of martial healing

[Pseudonym]

Penalty box refers to the party starting in say a 3x2 or 3x3 square at the start of battle all adjacent to one another. In many modules with area or burst creatures, this can mean much of the party is massacred before moving if the creatures get surprise.

When we do this in 4E the 40K part of my brain kicks in and I have visions of flamer or 3" templates being dropped on the lot of us.

 

[Aegeri]

When we do this in 4E the 40K part of my brain kicks in and I have visions of flamer or 3" templates being dropped on the lot of us.

Half of the way I design games now is to try and avoid this "penalty" box formation, instead growing encounters more organically. Alternatively, giving PCs more room to start in.

Infuriatingly, PCs frequently group up anyway completely contrary to what I'm trying to get them to do.

 

[Dice4Hire]

But a essential warlord would be nice.

I did not know Warlord have that low aception. Or Wizz thinks new players can not digest him ?

I love warlord on first sigh.. my favorite class. Cleric cant cover that.

sad.

WArlords are a great class, but simple, they ain't

So Essentials is going back to Clerical-only healing.

So what?

I wish people would stop acting like WOTC is gonna co to their house and furn all hteir books/wipe their computer of 4E stuff when essentials comes out.

But then again, these are just the 4E haters jumping on a new bandwagon.

 

[renau1g]

The warlord is the most tactically complex and rules fiddly class. It is not very likely to be something you use for new players, because getting the most out of it really does require work and management of multiple stats.

Especially with the variable builds that have one of the wonkiest stat spreads in the game. Taclords want a high Int, but some of the builds have it as close to a dump stat, Wis is either a dump stat or fairly important. The only constant is Str being high, and even that has an exception (Lazy Warlord). That may make it difficult for a new player.

 

[Shin Okada]

Well, Warlord does not appear in Essential books and boxes CURRENTLY planned. Does that mean Warlord will never appear in any of the future products of WotC? Who knows?

It took 2 years for psionic classes appear in 4th edition DnD from the release of the first 3 core books. They still have a month to get their "power" book.

Why can you say warlord will NEVER re-released in some essential style book --- or even some newer core books? Say, 4e rules encyclopedia or something like that. Even people in WotC are not truly sure what kind of books they are releasing in 2012 and after.

Besides, you (and new friends who starts DnD 4th from the essentials) can still buy PHB.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

WArlords are a great class, but simple, they ain't

So Essentials is going back to Clerical-only healing.

So what?

I wish people would stop acting like WOTC is gonna co to their house and furn all hteir books/wipe their computer of 4E stuff when essentials comes out.

But then again, these are just the 4E haters jumping on a new bandwagon.

I think part of that fear is being stoked due to the fact that- according to people that use CB (not me)- the original version of MM is gone, replaced by the newly revised retro auto-hit version of it...and apparently the revised version isn't to everyone's liking.

Do I think that this will happen with warlords and martial healing? No. But is is possible? Sure. There is nothing to stop WotC from revising the Warlord and excising martial healing from it in CB.

Does this do anything to those who have the books? Again, no- but not everyone playing 4Ed has the books. Some groups (like mine) have only one or 2 players with any of the books, with everyone else either borrowing books or, more commonly, using DDI/CB to play.

Then again, it is my understanding that Essentials classes will be kind of like the Darkpact, Feypact, Infernal Pact, Vestige Pact and Starlock Warlock types: all the same "class" but with varying perks & options.

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

When we do this in 4E the 40K part of my brain kicks in and I have visions of flamer or 3" templates being dropped on the lot of us.

"Crap, we're in 2 x 2 cover formation."

"Huh?"

"This means, among other things, the quarterback is toast."

Brad

 

[Aegeri]

I think part of that fear is being stoked due to the fact that- according to people that use CB (not me)- the original version of MM is gone, replaced by the newly revised retro auto-hit version of it...and apparently the revised version isn't to everyone's liking.

Is it really impossible to remember that magic missile was 2d4+intelligence modifier force damage. This goes up to 4d4+intelligence modifier damage at 21st level.

There you go, simple as can be.

Personally I think it's an awful controller power and the new ones they have published, like Arc Lightning are far superior. Except for a few very limited optimizations of MM, it wasn't regarded very highly as an at-will. The revised form at least has sparked debate about it and its uses - of which it does have a niche that its original form would just get further behind in (especially if the new Wizard at-wills are all of the quality in the article shown). Getting it as a class feature of the mage is even better and something I like a lot (I've already houseruled the new magic missile as a class feature for ALL wizards).

 

[BrokeAndDrive]

I petition we nickname Mike Mearls "Big Daddy" so we can say stuff like "Big Daddy has spoken."

Howabout "Grandpa" so we can i... err, nevermind.

 

[Garthanos]

We all understand that, but you miss the point. Anyone picking up the game from now on will be picking up Essentials. Its rather unlikely that the PHB etc will show up again. Unless players go out of their way to acquire older material it DOES become unavailable. You can I can play, but it will become 'that old PHB stuff' over time. Something that you could theoretically use, IF you can find the book(s).

I know, the "Its all in DDI" argument comes next, but really do many people go look up obsolescent material in DDI to use? Sure once in a while someone will, but if something is out of print it isn't really a first class part of the game anymore.

To go a step further.... would you buy the phb (I am going to assume these builds cover the mind space of the classes they cover and do so with design elegance I trust WOTC that much ... thats what being essential is).

If you had a book which pretty close to replaced the old phb... ie melee cleric by any other name (stat), would smell the same. Knight (Sword and Board Fighter) by any other name... Two handed er slayer by another name... would you bother with the Legacy book with a sloppy built strength cleric.. a paladin that is already fixed more elegantly with cleaner marking... and so on

And oh yeh there happens to be this odd peripheral class called the warlord.... "Martial leader... how is that possible I thought only the gods gave healing"