Ethical DM Dilemma in Shackled City - Spoiler

airwalkrr

Adventurer
Spoiler Alert!
If you are currently a player in a Shackled City campaign you might want to just skip this entire thread.

You've been warned.


TL;DR version: Is it okay to change a background secret of the campaign which a player has figured out, regardless of how spurious the player's evidence is or how silly the secret as written is?

So I have been wrestling with this, and wanted to ask some fellow players and DMs what they think. For those who are not in the know, one of the chief villains of the first half of this campaign is a beholder who masquerades as a member of the nobility in the city of Cauldron, where the campaign is based. The beholder makes an ominous appearance in the very first chapter of the campaign as a beholder, call it a cameo appearance. But the PCs learn scant little about him at this point. He shows up to whisk a child away for "safe-keeping." Anyway, all of that is beside the point.

The point is the PCs know from the very beginning of the campaign that there is a beholder in Cauldron, but they don't know where he is. Now, I have refrained from using his full name in my campaign, that of "Orbius Vhalantru" because it is just too obvious. I always refer to him simply as "Lord Vhalantru." The PCs are 13th level and have met Lord Vhalantru at several points now. One of the PCs has even gone into business with him. Because of their level they are expecting to run into the beholder literally any moment. And one of the players has figured it out (more on that later).

Now I have never given the PCs any real solid clues as to who the beholder is. That is because all of the important players in Cauldron have secrets to hide, whether they are good guys or bad guys, and they have the means to keep those secrets pretty well. Now the PCs know one thing for certain: Vhalantru is a bad guy. They have recently learned that he gave the order to have them killed. And they are about to deal with it. And when they do, the time of truth will arrive.

You see, this whole time I have kept the Vhalantru/beholder identity under tight wraps because to be frank, I always felt it was a little to obvious myself, not to mention ridiculous. The explanation is that the beholder has an item that casts an illusion to make him seem human. I find it hard to believe that for someone in the public eye as much as Vhalantru, not one person has ever pierced his illusion in one way (successful Will save) or another (true seeing). So I have kept an alternative explanation tucked away and now is the time when I need to decide whether or not to use it. The alternative explanation is that "the beholder" is actually the Lord Mayor, who has been missing for a few months (and guess who stepped in to take his place, Vhalantru). This explanation works perfectly because prior to encountering him, the beholder has been away tending to matters with the evil Cagewrights, a group plotting to open a permanent gate to Carceri (in my campaign, it is Xoriat because I have set it in Eberron). If the Lord Mayor is the beholder, this explains why the Lord Mayor might have gone missing. And if Vhalantru is just another noble, he could have easily been charmed by the beholder and forced to make a lot of bad decisions, like trying to have the party killed and raising taxes to pay for the Cagewrights' plans, especially if Vhalantru is an otherwise self-serving type individual (and most nobles are). Vhalantru might not be a paragon of virtue, but he's not necessarily a bad guy, a beholder has charmed him and brought out the worst in him and used him for his purposes.

So here is where the ethical dilemma comes in. As I mentioned earlier, one of the players has figured it out, so to speak. He doesn't really have any good reason. Every session he reiterates his position (and he has done this since the first session he heard the name "Vhalantru"): "Vhalantru must be the beholder because only a beholder would be named Vhalantru." That's his evidence right there. He rarely, if ever, points to anything else. Even some of the other players doubt him because they think it is silly to make accusations based on such "logic." I know all of the players pretty well. We sometimes hang out outside of gaming. None of the players (the one who guessed it included) has ever subscribed to Dungeon or purchased the Shackled City campaign book. So I am relatively certain they don't have any "insider information." In other words, they would never know the difference if I change the beholder and make it the Lord Mayor who "disappeared." But I would know that I took what might seem like an "I knew it!" moment away from a player.

So what do you think I should do? Go with the campaign as written and keep the silly "Orbius Vhalantru is a beholder!" moment but give the player his moment to feel gratified? Or go with the alternative explanation which I feel makes more sense?
 

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Crothian

First Post
Go with what you feel makes the game better and in this case makes more sense. I do this in the APs and then afterwards I give my players a little director's commentary type explanation of what I changed and why.
 

VariSami

First Post
I agree with Crothian: your model seems more plausible. After all, a mere illusion would not make the bulk of a Beholder disappear. As such, lord Vhalantru would need to have quite a lot of personal space at all times.

I find myself wondering: who the hell designed a game where it's flat-out implied that a Beholder is behind everything and then have the Beholder use the alias "Orbius"? It's way too obvious. Beholder pride, mayhap? It might indeed fit the fluff since those things are prideful and mad to the point of idiocy (in underestimating their non-beholder opponents).

But yeah, I don't even see an ethical dilemma here. Especially since your player's don't even know the details about the original material. A DM is free to modify things as he pleases - and in case your players knew about the material, doing so would actually be necessary in my humble opinion.
 
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I wouldn't punish your player for being clever. He could just be doing what my group did in Shackled City. We were convinced from Chapter 1 that Vhalantru was going to turn on us for ... some reason. And by the end of Chapter 2 we were urging everyone to move out of Cauldron because we figured the volcano was due for an eruption.

If they're 13th level, then they should be getting ready to visit Lady Thifirane and Lord Vhalantru. If I recall they'll discover that its not just an illusion that conceals Vhalantru but a whole suit he crams himself into that's damn near an artifact.

If you change it to the Lord Mayor being the beholder, how are you going to run the dungeon in Vhalantru's manor? Have it be the mayor's manor? How do you explain that it was Vhalantru that was raising taxes, bringing in half orcs mercenaries, and generally shaking down the city for as much gold as possible. Have the PCs had much interaction with the Lord Mayor? When I played SC the DM played up that Lord Vhalantru was at first just a trusted advisor. Later in the game the Lord Mayor started acting fearful for his life and was getting ready to send to Sasserine for help. But then Vhalantru ate him. ;)

I'd keep Vhalantru as the beholder. Let your player have his cookie for figuring it out and then beat him with the cookie jar as Vhalantru merges with the Demodand essence. ;)
 

I recommend posting over on Paizo.com. There's still an active community for the Shackled City Adventure Path (search for SCAP) and lots of fan-made content, some of it very good.

I'm currently running SCAP myself. We just finished Life's Bazaar (Chapter 1) and will skip to Flood Season (Chapter 3) -- they've had other adventures, so they don't need an adventure in between.

I've done a number of modifications to SCAP for my purposes. The main ones that might be relevant here are:
1) I took the Beholder out of the fight with Kazmojen. That fight is complex enough without a random beholder wandering in.

2) I made Vhalantru the main villain, but I made him a Rakhasa instead. It's a jungle out there, and Rakhasa's love to create complicated plots and naturally mascarade as humans well. Make him a Rakhasa with some Illusion magic and enough Wizard or Sorcerer levels to get 2 Greater Teleports per day, and retcon the original scene to a Rakhasa under the ILLUSION of being a Beholder took the boy, and you've got awesome when they find out THERE WAS NO BEHOLDER. Nobody expects a sneaky so-and-so monster to do illusions of being a different monster AND hide as a person. :)

3) I got rid of the extra planar stuff. When I get to that point in the story, I'll go right to the meeting of the City leaders, fight with the Conference of Bad Guys, and City blowing up scenes (toned down a bit in level). I'm not a fan of high level play or extra planar play.

4) I have a different motivation for the villains. Vhalantru wants to blow up the city as a mass sacrifice to bring back the Rakhasa god (Rakhasa being outsides native to the Prime Material Plane) from exile. Everybody else with their Carceri and Ebon Triad plots are being played as chumps -- Vhalantru is a villain's villain, messing with everyone else, even other bad guys. :lol:

5) Not really relevant but fun. I went to town on the society in Cauldron, and decided the place is literally nicknamed "The Shackled City" because it's wealth is built on slavery. Plantations, tropics, nobility living above the heat in a hilltop city -- it's all very reminscent of imperialism in the early British empire. I say no slaves allowed in the city (to keep it secure), and with a Greyhawk setting, the slaves are "savages" captured from the Amedio jungle (ferile Suloise) and the fallen civilization from the Olman lands.
 
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airwalkrr

Adventurer
If you change it to the Lord Mayor being the beholder, how are you going to run the dungeon in Vhalantru's manor? Have it be the mayor's manor? How do you explain that it was Vhalantru that was raising taxes, bringing in half orcs mercenaries, and generally shaking down the city for as much gold as possible. Have the PCs had much interaction with the Lord Mayor?
I always thought the simulacrum suit was a very silly magic item; essentially it was a fiat that no one could see through the disguise unless they had a really high Spot check. Problem is, plenty of people in Cauldron with high Spot checks would get to see Vhalantru on at least an occasional basis. Beholders don't go out in public. They charm and manipulate people into doing their bidding. Having read the whole AP already (and having played in it), I never saw anything that the Vhalantru did that couldn't be accomplished with a combination of beholder charm monster and Thifirane's transmutation. No need for the simulacrum suit whatsoever.

So here it is in a nutshell. There are two possibilities for the Lord Mayor. 1) He was a tool of Lady Thifirane and the beholder all along. The beholder charmed him and on occasion Lady Thifirane would polymorph either herself or the beholder into his visage. But he stopped cooperating, broke free of the charm, and had to be done away with, which explains his absence. 2) The beholder actually WAS the Lord Mayor, but didn't need anything fancy like a simulacrum suit because he was never in the public eye in the first place. On the rare occasions he needed to appear in public, Thifirane would polymorph him into human form. Either of these explanations works well.

When the beholder had to go away for awhile to deal with the Cagewrights, he and Thifirane found it easier to have the mayor "disappear" and let Vhalantru, a young and pliable noble with more money than he knew what to do with, take over the position of Lord Mayor. As a matter of fact, in my game, the politics of the city made this quite reasonable. The Aslaxin and Taskerhill families have always been at odds, something I have played up quite a bit. Traditionally they have always settled on a "compromise" candidate for Lord Mayor, someone whom both believed they could manipulate to their own ends. With the beholder already having charmed Vhalantru and built his dungeon base under Vhalantru's home, this played right into the Cagewright's hands. As a tool of the Cagewrights, Vhalantru proved to be far less pliable than the Aslaxin and Taskerhill families had hoped. He increased taxes and brought in House Tharashk (the half-orc mercenaries in my campaign) to assist in the collection of these new taxes.
I recommend posting over on Paizo.com. There's still an active community for the Shackled City Adventure Path (search for SCAP) and lots of fan-made content, some of it very good.
That is a great idea. Thanks!
2) I made Vhalantru the main villain, but I made him a Rakhasa instead. It's a jungle out there, and Rakhasa's love to create complicated plots and naturally mascarade as humans well. Make him a Rakhasa with some Illusion magic and enough Wizard or Sorcerer levels to get 2 Greater Teleports per day, and retcon the original scene to a Rakhasa under the ILLUSION of being a Beholder took the boy, and you've got awesome when they find out THERE WAS NO BEHOLDER. Nobody expects a sneaky so-and-so monster to do illusions of being a different monster AND hide as a person. :)
This I like. The idea of Vhalantru as a rakshasa would be awesome, especially considering that I have my game set in Eberron. Vhalantru could actually be an agent of the Lords of Dust whose endgame is to become ruler of Cauldron after the Cagewrights have built their gate to Xoriat and then use his power to help free the Overlords. Then he'd still be a villain. The beholder could be just an illusion created by Thifirane when she went to pick up Terrem. I like this idea quite a lot.
 

Sekhmet

First Post
I absolutely agree with your decision (and reasoning) for wanting to change the identity of the villain.
Level 13, and no one has seen through that illusion? Something is definitely not right with that scenario.

The rakshasa idea is fantastic.
 

nijineko

Explorer
you could even have the beholder be on retainer. it could be the fall eye... ahem, i mean the fall guy so the rakshasa can fade out and escape if it needs a scapegoat villain to poke in the... i mean finger for the blame.
 

pauljathome

First Post
You should absolutely go with your instincts and change things up where you think appropriate. Adventure Paths work much better as a structure on which to build than as a straight jacket. Feel free to change anything and everything.

Never having played that particular AP I have no specific advice on what changes you should make.
 


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